toasters February 2002

toasters@lists.teaparty.net

78 participants
92 discussions

what disks can i use in an F330?
by Brian Hechinger 17 Feb '02

17 Feb '02

i've got an F330 that i'd like to get online one of these days, and i'd like to get the most storage onto it that i possibly can. it's got 5 narrow SCSI channels on it, and i have a whole slew of DEC BA350 StorageWorks shelves to hook up to it. what is the largest size drives i can put on this thing? is there a particular model of drive that i am limited to? also, what are my options for a wide scsi controller or two in this thing? several of the BA350 shelves have 16-bit personality cards in them, and i'd love to be able to take advantage of that rather than downgrade them to 8-bit personality cards. i think that's all the questions i have for now. next step after getting disks on it, find a copy of the OS for it. -brian

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URGENT ASSISTANCE
by chidi john 16 Feb '02

16 Feb '02

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RE: Slow write performance
by Art Hebert 16 Feb '02

16 Feb '02

What is the wafl command to check the layout of data, etc. thanks art -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Kennedy [mailto:jlkennedy@amcc.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 6:21 AM To: EH(a)dataconnection.com Cc: Mike Ball; Toasters (E-mail) Subject: Re: Slow write performance This was an issue for sure, I've been through it myself. However, you can use the wafl commands to check the layout of data and, if necessary, re-stripe it. I think the '1 disk add' issue is no longer a real issue.... ~JK Mike Ball wrote: > > Edward, > I not sure I would be concerned about the 0's on disk writes you are > seeing. As long as Net KB keeps coming in/out. The Netapp may be > recalculating parity and holding the writes in NVRAM before it flushes to > disk, etc.. As for the volume being full, I see a lot of customers only add > 1 disk at a time when the volumes get full. This causes a problem because > you basically do not stripe across disks. You only are writing to one disk. > At this point you become disk bound which could very well be what is > happening here. Make sure you add disks a few at a time when you grow your > volume to stripe the data among drives. > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Edward Hibbert [mailto:EH@dataconnection.com] > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 8:29 AM > To: 'Mike Ball' > Subject: RE: Slow write performance > > Mike, > > I can send you a couple of the outputs straight away. sysstat doesn't > recognise the -u option; what's the difference between that and sysstat 1? > > I take your point about network settings - we've had problems in this area > before - but I don't understand why I would get 0 disk writes for a long > time while still getting network traffic in and out. I know that my network > traffic during such a period includes write requests (from pktt trace), so > what I'm wondering is what causes the writes to hang up and then recover. > > The disk on /vol/vol0 has previously got very full. Although we've now > freed up some space, do you think there might be persistant fragmentation? > > Edward. > > nacolt1*> df > Filesystem kbytes used avail capacity Mounted on > /vol/vol0/ 95328924 54170444 41158480 57% /vol/vol0/ > /vol/vol0/.snapshot 0 0 0 ---% > /vol/vol0/.snapshot > /vol/vol1/ 63552616 60599768 2952848 95% /vol/vol1/ > /vol/vol1/.snapshot 0 0 0 ---% > /vol/vol1/.snapshot > > Volume vol0 (root) > > RAID group 0 > > RAID Disk HA.ID HA SHELF BAY CHAN Used (MB/blks) Phys > (MB/blks) > --------- ----- ------------ ---- -------------- > -------------- > parity 8.3 8 0 3 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > data 8.4 8 0 4 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > data 8.1 8 0 1 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > data 8.0 8 0 0 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > > Volume vol1 > > RAID group 0 > > RAID Disk HA.ID HA SHELF BAY CHAN Used (MB/blks) Phys > (MB/blks) > --------- ----- ------------ ---- -------------- > -------------- > parity 8.2 8 0 2 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > data 8.6 8 0 6 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > data 8.5 8 0 5 FC:A 34500/70656000 > 35003/71687368 > nacolt1*> > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mike Ball [mailto:MBall@DATALINK.com] > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 1:07 PM > To: Edward Hibbert > Subject: RE: Slow write performance > > Edward, > Trying forcing the switch you plug into to 100Mb Full duplex. In > addition, instead of making e0 auto negotiate, force it to 100Mb full > duplex. Your network KB/s is pretty low. Also, how full is your file system? > Can you send me the output of the following commands: > > df > sysstat -u 1 (run for 20 seconds) > sysconfig -r > > Thank you, > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Edward Hibbert [mailto:EH@dataconnection.com] > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 5:27 PM > To: 'Mike Ball' > Subject: RE: Slow write performance > > Here's the sysstat. Interesting that this shows periodic 0 writes. > > Tue Feb 5 22:22:30 GMT [tn_login_0]: root logged in from host: > 192.168.21.16 > sysstat 1 > CPU NFS CIFS HTTP Net kB/s Disk kB/s Tape kB/s Cache > in out read write read write age > 54% 1012 0 1 393 1494 2430 2446 0 0 1 > 43% 1012 0 0 431 1549 2302 3947 0 0 1 > 46% 1278 0 0 471 1787 2708 1116 0 0 1 > 57% 1080 0 0 611 2019 2078 5177 0 0 1 > 31% 726 0 0 439 1056 840 1028 0 0 1 > 37% 962 0 0 388 1872 1561 0 0 0 1 > 32% 919 0 0 404 1786 1688 0 0 0 1 > 33% 1050 0 0 407 1815 1529 0 0 0 1 > 43% 1102 0 0 623 2148 1264 0 0 0 1 > 43% 857 0 1 347 1585 2154 0 0 0 1 > 38% 746 0 0 430 1878 1704 0 0 0 1 > 58% 463 0 1 255 800 2610 3675 0 0 1 > 52% 997 0 0 517 1544 2840 2084 0 0 1 > 48% 792 0 0 401 1350 2222 5365 0 0 1 > 50% 1028 0 0 429 2055 2264 2108 0 0 1 > 37% 864 0 0 304 1864 1893 2210 0 0 1 > 39% 1053 0 0 566 2154 988 8 0 0 1 > 45% 1143 0 0 604 2309 1733 0 0 0 1 > 35% 1034 0 0 420 2123 1860 0 0 0 1 > CPU NFS CIFS HTTP Net kB/s Disk kB/s Tape kB/s Cache > in out read write read write age > 42% 1000 0 0 550 2016 1264 0 0 0 1 > 52% 1118 0 1 575 2541 1589 0 0 0 1 > 30% 791 0 0 327 1648 1880 0 0 0 1 > 48% 880 0 0 382 1896 2022 1905 0 0 1 > 47% 745 0 1 354 1354 2196 2828 0 0 1 > 57% 1287 0 0 581 1772 2366 3583 0 0 1 > 51% 1136 0 0 595 1929 2488 1168 0 0 1 > 48% 987 0 0 419 1273 2348 3504 0 0 1 > 35% 768 0 0 421 1623 1597 720 0 0 1 > 45% 1237 0 0 624 2465 1869 0 0 0 1 > 38% 1112 0 0 390 1995 1688 0 0 0 1 > 44% 1044 0 0 585 1817 1697 0 0 0 1 > > ifconfig output: > > e0: flags=240043<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,UP_1ARY,LINK_UP> mtu 1500 > inet 192.168.21.81 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.168.21.255 > ether 00:a0:98:00:97:67 (auto-100tx-fd-up) > lo: flags=240049<UP,LOOPBACK,RUNNING,UP_1ARY,LINK_UP> mtu 1536 > inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000 broadcast 127.0.0.1 > > Regards, > > Edward. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mike Ball [mailto:MBall@DATALINK.com] > Sent: 05 February 2002 19:58 > To: Edward Hibbert; toasters > Subject: RE: Slow write performance > > Edward, > Telnet to the netapp and type "sysstat 1". Let it run for about 20 > seconds and send us the output. Also, type "ifconfig -a" and send us the > output. > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Edward Hibbert [mailto:EH@dataconnection.com] > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 2:24 PM > To: toasters > Subject: Slow write performance > > We're seeing some performance problems on an F720 which you guys might be > able to help with (even though it's not exactly top of the range nowadays). > > What we see is: > - We're driving it over NFS v3. > - We get about 1500 ops/sec out of it, of which one third are writes and two > thirds are reads. There aren't many file open/close operations. > - The operations are to random locations in large (10GB) files. > - The CPU is running about 75%, and the network input and output below the > throughput of the link we have to it. We've seen both CPU and network go > higher if we do simple copy tests. > - Looking it it via pktt trace, something approaching 15% of WRITE > operations take long enough for the clients to time out and retransmit (so > at least 1 second). None of the READ operations do. > - The retransmissions appear to come in bunches. For example we'll see a > few seconds where the filer doesn't respond, during which time the > retransmissions will come in, then it will wake up and send some responses > back. > - The rest of the time, the WRITES are very fast (sub-ms). > > This appears to have worsened recently. We tried a couple of things: > - We thought that this might be because the disk had got full and > fragmented, so we zapped a bunch of data. > - We rebooted. > Neither of these seemed to help much. > > sysstat consistently shows a cache age of 1. This, and the bursty nature of > the delays, suggest to me that I'm just hitting it too hard, and there's > some kind of periodic cache-flushing operation going on, but do any of you > folk have any other suggestions? > > Edward Hibbert > Internet Applications Group > Data Connection Ltd > Tel: +44 131 662 1212 Fax: +44 131 662 1345 > Email: eh(a)dataconnection.com Web: http://www.dataconnection.com -- ===================== Jeff Kennedy Unix Administrator AMCC jlkennedy(a)amcc.com

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smbcacls
by neil lehrer 15 Feb '02

15 Feb '02

can anyone point me at some decent examples, the man page is not giving me enough info. i want to set rwx,rwxd,rwxd on a dir. thanks --

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RE: Block sizes
by Edward Hibbert 14 Feb '02

14 Feb '02

Cheers, that 64 bytes is interesting. Do you get a perf benefit on access to the file, too? Is it affected by long filenames at all? Edward. -----Original Message----- From: Steve Losen [mailto:scl@sasha.acc.virginia.edu] Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 3:46 PM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: Block sizes > Also worthy of note, to date there is no way to modify the block size. > It's hardcoded in wafl. > > ~JK While we're on the subject of WAFL trivia, WAFL does not split a 4K block into fragments, so files always consume disk space in even multiples of 4K bytes. However, if the length of a file is 64 bytes or less, then the file data is stored in the inode and no data blocks are consumed. WAFL uses the space in the inode that otherwise holds the data block list. This is nice because most symbolic links are small enough to fit in the inode. Steve Losen scl(a)virginia.edu phone: 434-924-0640 University of Virginia ITC Unix Support

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RE: Block sizes
by Strange, Steve 14 Feb '02

14 Feb '02

> Or is this all wrong, and the access doesn't occur in blocks? It does occur in blocks, and the WAFL block size is 4K bytes. Steve > -----Original Message----- > From: Edward Hibbert [mailto:EH@dataconnection.com] > Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 5:27 PM > To: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Block sizes > > > A question about block sizes on NetApp disks. > > My impression is that disk access occurs in blocks. So if I > write 1 byte to > a disk, at some level the OS has a block in cache, updates > the block, then > writes that block out to disk. If I write 20K, then it > probably affects > multiple blocks. > > If this is true, then it might be useful to know the > underlying block size - > because if I could ensure that my application wasn't spanning multiple > blocks when I didn't need to be, I could give the physical > disks a bit less > of a hard time. > > Does anyone know how to find this out? Or is this all wrong, > and the access > doesn't occur in blocks? > > Thanks, > > Edward. >

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RE: win2k native mode and ontap integration
by Kumar, Rahul 14 Feb '02

14 Feb '02

Hi All, Thanks for your help regarding the same... I really appreciate your help. I will follow the steps as we plan to move filers into native mode sometime next week. Thanks once again.. ----------- Rahul Kumar -----Original Message----- From: Garandet, Jean Francois [mailto:jfgarand@netapp.com] Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 4:21 PM To: 'FPS France'; Kumar, Rahul; toasters(a)mathworks.com Cc: Bon, Albert Subject: RE: win2k native mode and ontap integration Yes, Windows 2000 native mode use time base synchronisation (win32time) between clients & servers to obtain kerberos authentification ticket(specification for MIT Kerberos version 5) it's important to don't stop this service: "windows time" It's important to use timebase server (ntp server) for the filer in full integration in windows 2000 with kerberos authentifcation... It's available for all Windows2000/XP Clients/Servers version... Jean-Francois GARANDET -----Original Message----- From: FPS France [mailto:fpsfrance@fps.fr] Sent: jeudi 14 février 2002 10:16 To: Kumar, Rahul; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: win2k native mode and ontap integration yes, they surely can do this. This is possible from the 6.1 version. Simply restart cifs setup. Make sure the time delta beetween Filers and the Win2k ad is less than 5 min (ideally synchronize them). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kumar, Rahul" <Rahul.Kumar(a)sdrc.com> To: <toasters(a)mathworks.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 3:56 PM Subject: win2k native mode and ontap integration > > Hi All, > We are using win2k ad in mixed mode...We are also have 3-4 filers > running 6.1.1R2. > Will the filers be able to work in native mode of window2000 ad. > If not then which version of ontap supports this. > > > ----------- > Rahul > :

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RE: win2k native mode and ontap integration
by Garandet, Jean Francois 14 Feb '02

14 Feb '02

Yes, Windows 2000 native mode use time base synchronisation (win32time) between clients & servers to obtain kerberos authentification ticket(specification for MIT Kerberos version 5) it's important to don't stop this service: "windows time" It's important to use timebase server (ntp server) for the filer in full integration in windows 2000 with kerberos authentifcation... It's available for all Windows2000/XP Clients/Servers version... Jean-Francois GARANDET -----Original Message----- From: FPS France [mailto:fpsfrance@fps.fr] Sent: jeudi 14 février 2002 10:16 To: Kumar, Rahul; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: win2k native mode and ontap integration yes, they surely can do this. This is possible from the 6.1 version. Simply restart cifs setup. Make sure the time delta beetween Filers and the Win2k ad is less than 5 min (ideally synchronize them). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kumar, Rahul" <Rahul.Kumar(a)sdrc.com> To: <toasters(a)mathworks.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 3:56 PM Subject: win2k native mode and ontap integration > > Hi All, > We are using win2k ad in mixed mode...We are also have 3-4 filers > running 6.1.1R2. > Will the filers be able to work in native mode of window2000 ad. > If not then which version of ontap supports this. > > > ----------- > Rahul > :

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win2k native mode and ontap integration
by Kumar, Rahul 14 Feb '02

14 Feb '02

Hi All, We are using win2k ad in mixed mode...We are also have 3-4 filers running 6.1.1R2. Will the filers be able to work in native mode of window2000 ad. If not then which version of ontap supports this. ----------- Rahul

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toasters February 2002