toasters

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13515 discussions

Converting F230 SCSI drives to F740
by Mike Ball 15 Jun '99

15 Jun '99

We have a F230 with about 100GB of data. We have just purchased a F740 with a shelf of 18GB Fibre drives and two empty dual SCSI shelves. We have 9GB SCSI drives on the F230 which can be moved to the F740 Dual SCSI shelves. My question is since we are running a Data Ontap 4.3.3 on the F230, I will be upgrading it to 5.2.2 before I physically move the SCSI drives over to the F740 system. Since the source code for the Data Ontap on the F230 is Intel based versus Alpha based on the F740 am I going to run into issues. As it stands right now, I am planning on having my root volume to boot off of on the Fibre drives. Since the volume on the F230 is already named vol0 I am renaming the root volume on the F740 Fibre drives to vol1. Once this has been completed, it looks like I can simply power down both the F230 and the F740, move the disks from the F230 SCSI shelves to the F740 SCSI shelves. Power up the Fibre and SCSI shelves on the F740, and be on my way. The F740 will boot off the root volume on the Fibre drives and I should be able to see both volumes once the system has completed the boot process. Once both volumes are confirmed to be online and functioning , I would then make vol0 (volume on SCSI disks) the root volume and reboot the system. Does everything here sound correct and if so how will the Intel Data Ontap code on the SCSI drives from the F230 be converted to Alpha code?

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Thanks.
by Shaun T. Erickson 15 Jun '99

15 Jun '99

I recently mentioned that we were having major trouble with our F540. I just wanted to thank the NetApp folks who've been so helpful the past week: Puneet Anand, Jim Ripley, Kirk & Pamela. They really came through for us. Our system isn't fixed, but our replacement loaner system is up and running and serving our data just fine. Thanks, NetApp. :-) -ste Work: (908) 582-7629 Pager: (800) 756-1133 Cell: (201) 310-9941

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NFS ACLs
by tkaczma＠gryf.net 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

Just came across this in Solaris docs: --- NFS Parameters for the nfs Module [...] nfs_acl_cache - This symbol controls whether ACLs are cached on clients that are using the NFS_ACL protocol. --- Does anyone know of any info on the NFS ACL protocol? Is this what we were just speaking of? Tom

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Re: AFS/DFS??!! :-) (and FTP!)
by sirbruce＠ix.netcom.com 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

On 06/12/99 17:04:02 you wrote: > >>DFS is a pretty small market. AFS isn't much better, assuming you >>mean Andrew. If you're talking Apple, now there's a potential market. >Apple toooooo. >In fact we have over 400 of those puppies in our dept alone and when we >bough the very first FAServer450 (No, not the F540, the 450 with 2 G disks!) Actually, before the 450 was the 400, which could only hold half as many disks (7). If you wanted 14 you had to buy a second cabinet and run an external SCSI cable to it. I thought the cabinets looked pretty cool, but the 450 was certainly impressive. I've never seen a bigger PC tower case in my life! Also, for a while 1G disks were supported as well. (Actually, I suspect they still are, if you had one lying around that you could fit!) But by the time Netcom got its first filer in late 1993 2G disks were the norm. >in early '94 that was the very first request I had with their then V.P. >On the other hand I have mixed feeling when requesting new features >and additional protocol support. One of the key strength of an appliance, >in my school, is it's simplicity of usage and administration. >When the first FAServer's rolled out it had fewer than 50 commands with >a 300 page admin book and hell of a fewer lines of code compared to other >traditional UNIX systems. However, the admin book, while thin, was seriously lacking in a lot of important details! The appliance is still really simple *except* in the edge cases, and then you have to know exactly what you're doing. This is the trade-off you get for faster response when there's a failure -- you can fix the problem yourself. >As we request all these neat features I wonder how much are we shooting >ourselves on the foot. I think so long as the filer sticks to *file service* and the related protocols it will be fine. For the most part having the other features "around" doesn't hurt performance for the other functions. In other words, having the trunking code or the PC-NFS support doesn't hurt your NFS access performance when you aren't using them (or even when you are). If the filer got into other areas... for example, trying to be a DNS server and a SMTP server on the same box, then I'd be annoyed. (I must reluctantly accept the idea that the filer should be a Domain Controller for NT, simply because that's a necessary component for their file service.) >Once I heard that just adding ATM support on the NIC increased the number >of lines of code by an order of magnitude! I doubt ATM alone was that bad. 10 times, no. 2 times, maybe. :) I don't know exactly how small the 1.0 version code was; I suppose it could have taken up as little as 10% of the original floppy. So today's code might be 10 times bigger now, but I don't think that's all due to ATM. I suspect CIFS support must be a big chunk. But you're still talking a very small part of the filer's overall memory reserve, so bigger executables aren't really a factor in performance. Most of code size concerns are a maintenance issue. It is all supposedly highly segmented and integrated, however, so all those extra lines of code don't slow down the data path from the network interface down to WAFL appreciably compared to the original code. There is more work to be done in a multiprotocol environment, but it is well worth the tradeoff. Bruce

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RE: the virus
by Garrett Burke 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

Hi, Files on the toaster will be set to size zero. Be very careful if your toaster contains source code as the virus attacks .cpp, .c and .h files. Thank god for snapshots. GB > ---------- > From: Steve Armijo[SMTP:armijo@cs.unm.edu] > Sent: 11 June 1999 09:17 > To: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: the virus > > > ok, so amid all this wild virus scare, does anyone here know what the > potential of this is to affect PC users who have shortcuts/mapped drives > pointing at toasters? > > -steve > > -- > Cue the music, fade to black, no such thing as no payback. -PWEI > > [ armijo(a)cs.unm.edu ] >

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RE: NFS ACLs
by tkaczma＠gryf.net 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

Warning, he worm finaly made it to the newsgroup. Tom On Mon, 14 Jun 1999, Kinney, Roger wrote: > Hi ! > I received your email and I shall send you a reply ASAP. > Till then, take a look at the attached zipped docs. > bye. > <<zipped_files.exe>> >

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Re: the virus
by Jason D. Kelleher 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

In message <1BF7EB8768B8D211B29400E02905846232C38F(a)atlas.rsinc.com>, Jim San ford writes: >Public canings are an option, but how about a public "live hookup" to about >4000 volts?? Wouldn't smell as nice, but I think it's an alternative worth considering... :) jason

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RE: Quickest way to move data.
by Melvin, Grant 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

Hi Shaun, > We would like to know what would be the quickest way to get the data moved > from one system to the other. Doing it accross our 100Mb net could take a > couple of days, which is unacceptable. Could we put a scsi card in the > F740, attach our F540's shelves and do volcopys? Any other suggestions? We > need the downtime to be the absolute minimum. We've recently updated "Migrating Data Between NetApp Filers" paper on the NetApp web site. Hopefully this can be of some help in explaining the different methods that we support, check it out at: http://www.netapp.com/technology/level3/3018.html > Also, if it's fibre-channel only, how am I supposed to attach my > scsi-based DLT jukebox, so I can continue to back up the replacement filer > via NDMP? Is there a scsi port on an F740, just for use by a tape drive? The F700 series has an on-board fast/wide/differential for tape backup. Cheers, Grant

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RE: the virus
by Jim Sanford 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

Public canings are an option, but how about a public "live hookup" to about 4000 volts?? ********************************* Jim Sanford IS Department Research Systems, Inc. ********************************* -----Original Message----- From: Marc A Levy [mailto:malevy@dnrc.bell-labs.com] Sent: Monday, June 14, 1999 8:46 AM To: Jason D. Kelleher Cc: tkaczma(a)gryf.net; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: the virus In theory, The worm/trojan he wrote could have deleted the research for the drug that would one day save his life... "Jason D. Kelleher" wrote: > > In message <Pine.LNX.4.04.9906111910090.1584-100000(a)gryf.gryf.net>, tkaczma@ > gryf.net writes: > > > >On Fri, 11 Jun 1999, Brian Pawlowski wrote: > > > >> Were any customers on this alias affected by the worm? > >> I will understand if you don't want to tell me. > > > >I didn't , I feel left out. I don't think the trojan worm made it out to > >the alias. > > I got a copy of it, but wasn't affected. Large mailing lists in > address books give these "new" worms interesting vectors. The > subject "RE: Early Access" combined with the worm message text and > the fact that it came from a vendor employee gave it a nice > illusion of legitimacy. Unpleasant. > > So, quick vote: Those in favor of public canings for virus authors > say aye. > > jason

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Homeworkers Needed !
by bretu213＠mindspring.com 14 Jun '99

14 Jun '99

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Re: Quickest way to move data.
by grdodson＠lexmark.com 13 Jun '99

13 Jun '99

> We would like to know what would be the quickest way to get the data moved > from one system to the other. Doing it accross our 100Mb net could take a > couple of days, which is unacceptable. Could we put a scsi card in the > F740, attach our F540's shelves and do volcopys? Any other suggestions? We > need the downtime to be the absolute minimum. You don't say how much data is on your F540. And assuming you don't want to risk "moving your problem" to the F740 by attaching/installing H/W from the F530 on the F740, my suggestion would be "ndmpcopy". We get about 10GB to 12GB transfer speeds with ndmpcopy between two filers on full duplex 100M ethernet. It's MUCH faster than a tar or dump/restore over the net. But it will not copy your snapshots. > Also, if it's fibre-channel only, how am I supposed to attach my > scsi-based DLT jukebox, so I can continue to back up the replacement filer > via NDMP? Is there a scsi port on an F740, just for use by a tape drive? Our F760 has a DIFFERENTIAL wide SCSI port on the motherboard. (for tapes) I suspect the F740 would be the same. The key word here is "differential". I suspect that your F540 is single ended, so you will need a converter to attach your DLTs to the F740 Graydon Dodson grdodson(a)lexmark.com Lexmark International Inc.

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Re: AFS/DFS??!! :-) (and FTP!)
by sirbruce＠ix.netcom.com 13 Jun '99

13 Jun '99

On 06/12/99 11:04:25 you wrote: > >> BTW, did NetApp ever consider putting AFS on the Filers? >Excellent question! >I keep asking NetApp every couple of years since about '94 for DFS >and the answer, of course diplomatic, is a firm 'no' followed >by "there is not enough market for DFS, NT will be our next target". DFS is a pretty small market. AFS isn't much better, assuming you mean Andrew. If you're talking Apple, now there's a potential market. A high-performance Apple file server would be welcome to a lot of folks. However, I don't know what Apple's plans are for the future; are they moving away from their filesystem format? Personally I'd like to see the filer have native FTP support. Just stick wuftpd in there and optimize the file transfer. Lots of ftp sites on the Internet would love it. (FTP direct to the filer rather than through a server to a filer should be measurably faster just like doing HTTP direct is.) Bruce

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RE: Metadata preservation during network file backup
by Benn, Paul 12 Jun '99

12 Jun '99

Hi Tom, Do you mean: "does UNIX support ACLs"? Some flavors of UNIX (e.g. Solaris) support their own proprietary ACLs (and as far as I know, none of the UNIX ACLs are compatible with each other). The filer does not support UNIX ACLs, just UNIX-style file permissions. UNIX file permissions are retained when backing up a filer via NFS or CIFS. NT ACLs are NOT retained when backing up a multiprotocol filer via NFS. Regards, Paul -----Original Message----- From: tkaczma(a)gryf.net [mailto:tkaczma@gryf.net] Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 1999 1:35 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: Metadata preservation during network file backup On Tue, 8 Jun 1999, Itzik (Itzhak) Meirson DSc. wrote: > If backing up this share from CIFS will the NFS ACLs be preserved upon > restore? Does NFS support ACLs? Tom

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Quickest way to move data.
by Shaun T. Erickson 12 Jun '99

12 Jun '99

We are experiencing major problems with our F540. NetApp is working with us on it. While trying to get us through our crisis, they have also suggested that they may temporarily provide us with an F740, complete with enough fibre-channel disks to hold the data on our F540. We would like to know what would be the quickest way to get the data moved from one system to the other. Doing it accross our 100Mb net could take a couple of days, which is unacceptable. Could we put a scsi card in the F740, attach our F540's shelves and do volcopys? Any other suggestions? We need the downtime to be the absolute minimum. Also, if it's fibre-channel only, how am I supposed to attach my scsi-based DLT jukebox, so I can continue to back up the replacement filer via NDMP? Is there a scsi port on an F740, just for use by a tape drive? -ste Work: (908) 582-7629 Pager: (800) 756-1133 Cell: (201) 310-9941

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Re: Quickest way to move data.
by mds＠gbnet.net 12 Jun '99

12 Jun '99

BareMetalMove, or whatever it's called now, worked very well a year or so ago and I imagine that your SE's can help you set up something along those lines with a back-to-back 100BaseTX-fd connection. FDDI also works quite well. I seem to recall that we got about 5MB/s from a 1400 to an F330 over a FDDI connection. I'd be surprised if you couldn't get a fair bit closer to wire speed between an F540 and an F740. It tooks us just over 1hour 20minutes to move our 20GB of data from the 486-based filer to the P90 - which I recall blew me away totally. Now, I'm presuming you've got a maximally configured F540 (in terms of disk) which ISTR is about 300GB. 300GB, at 10MB/s (wire-speed on 100BaseTX-fd) takes about 9 hours. If it goes at 5MB/s it takes 18 hours. If you've got less *used* disk-space it takes less time. ISTR that BMM makes a verbatim, swizzled copy of the filer so I don't think you lose snapshots or anything. The only thing to be careful of is the DOT version installed (being alpha - should be okey) on the new filer, and the network interface references in hosts and rc before booting it and getting going. Plus there was some slight untidiness in the final part of the BMM when I used it a goodly while ago - I think it needed to be booted without the contents of NVRAM or somesuch, which was fine because it wasn't actually normal fs data in there, though I'm probably misremembering totally now. Doing this stuff over a normal network, or with either filer up and serving is a different, and slower, matter. You'd probably need to use ndmpcopy or something and that's a bizarre fish from what I've experienced. On Sat 12 Jun, 1999, "Shaun T. Erickson" <ste(a)research.bell-labs.com> wrote: > While trying to get us through our crisis, they have also suggested that > they may temporarily provide us with an F740, complete with enough > fibre-channel disks to hold the data on our F540. Sounds good - it'll go faster too 8) > > We would like to know what would be the quickest way to get the data moved > from one system to the other. Doing it accross our 100Mb net could take a > couple of days, which is unacceptable. Could we put a scsi card in the > F740, attach our F540's shelves and do volcopys? Any other suggestions? We > need the downtime to be the absolute minimum. You might be able to do that - but I'd keep the F540 integral so it *can* be fixed, and avoid importing weird configs into the machine your going to use to tide you over until the normal box is working again. > > Also, if it's fibre-channel only, how am I supposed to attach my > scsi-based DLT jukebox, so I can continue to back up the replacement filer > via NDMP? Is there a scsi port on an F740, just for use by a tape drive? SCSI connections to tape drives are still there. Upto two controllers with two drives on each tape chain IIRC. Fibrechannel tape controllers are not common yet, so your DLT will be supported for a goodly while yet. > > -ste > > Work: (908) 582-7629 Pager: (800) 756-1133 Cell: (201) 310-9941 > >-- End of excerpt from "Shaun T. Erickson"

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Re: the virus
by sirbruce＠ix.netcom.com 12 Jun '99

12 Jun '99

On 06/11/99 11:54:02 you wrote: >The nice thing about using linux/unix is that all those viruses cann't do >much. The bad thing about linux/unix is that when you get hacked it is >messy! It depends on the environment. You'd be surprised the number of companies that have poor internal unix security, because they don't want to invest the time and money on something they may never need. Many IT professionals fail the understand the cost of bad internal security.

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RE: NFS ACLs
by Chen, Ray 11 Jun '99

11 Jun '99

I believe IRIX does allow you to set ACLs over NFS if you're running a reasonable version of Trusted IRIX. But I'm not sure if it uses the same proplistd side-band protocol or if they rolled their own and both the client and server have to be running SGI Trusted IRIX. Also, from what I gather, various draft versions of Posix ACLs had some reasonable significant differences so without detailed information on the exact ACL semantics, I couldn't say how similar the Solaris, Digital, and IRIX semantics are. For NFS v4, the situation is further complicated by the fact that HPUX ACLs and NT ACLs are different as well. Ray > -----Original Message----- > From: Guy Harris [mailto:guy@netapp.com] > Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 2:57 AM > To: tkaczma(a)gryf.net > Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Re: NFS ACLs > > > > > > Just came across this in Solaris docs: > > > > --- > > > > NFS Parameters for the nfs Module > > > > [...] > > > > nfs_acl_cache - This symbol controls whether ACLs are > cached on clients > > that are using the NFS_ACL protocol. > > > > --- > > > > Does anyone know of any info on the NFS ACL protocol? > > See "/usr/include/rpcsvc/nfs_acl.x" on Solaris 2.5 and later. It uses > port 2049, and the Solaris NFS server code presumably just checks the > program number as well as the procedure number and version number, and > runs either an NFS procedure or an NFS ACL procedure. > > > Is this what we were just speaking of? > > I think at least some folks here were speaking of it, yes. > > I think Digital^H^H^H^H^H^H^HTru64 UNIX may store ACLs as items in a > file's property list; the "proplist(4)" man page on a DU system here > says: > > DIGITAL UNIX supports the storing, parsing, and retrieving > of Extended File > Attributes. An Extended File Attribute is a name and value > pair that is > contained in a variable-sized structure called a Property > List. A Property > List is part of a file's metadata and can contain abstract > name and value > pairs (Extended File Attributes) that can be set either by > the operating > system (for example, ACLs and privileges) or by a > user-level application > (for example, PC File Attributes). > > That man page also says: > > Extended File Attributes are supported by the Advanced File > System (AdvFS) > and the UNIX File System (UFS). Currently, the Network > File System (NFS) > does not support Extended File Attributes, so when files > migrate over NFS, > they loose any Extended File Attributes they may have had. > > but the "proplistd(8)" man page says: > > The proplistd daemon services sideband protocol requests > from NFS clients > for property list operations. Requests may be to get, set, > and or delete > the property list associated with an NFS served file system object. > > so I'm not sure if the "proplist(4)" man page is out of date or if the > NFS client doesn't use the RPC service offered by > "proplistd", although > if the latter is true, that raises the question "so why does > 'proplistd' > exist?" > > I think AIX may also have ACL support, and I think somebody > earlier said > IRIX does; I don't know whether either of them let you get or set ACLs > over the wire with a "sideband" protocol for NFS. > > HP-UX has ACLs, but the HP-UX 11.00 man page says: > > NFS NFS does not support ACLs on remote files. > Individual manual > entries specify the behavior of various system > calls, library > calls, and commands under these circumstances. Be > careful when > transferring a file with optional entries over a > network or when > manipulating a remote file because optional entries may be > silently deleted. > > The Solaris and Digital UNIX ACLs appear to be based on POSIX drafts > (the POSIX committee working on that stuff never went past > drafts, and I > think they disbanded; the DU ones directly claim to be > POSIX-draft-based, the Solaris ones just look as if they > are). I don't > know what the AIX or IRIX ones look like; the HP-UX ones don't look at > all POSIX-draft-based (they appear to have a whole pile of additional > functionality). >

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RE: the virus
by Jonas Jonsson 11 Jun '99

11 Jun '99

-----Original Message----- From: yann.golanski(a)ThePLAnet.net [mailto:yann.golanski@ThePLAnet.net] Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 12:54 PM To: toasters @ mathworks . com Subject: Re: the virus >Quoting Garrett Burke <Garrett.Burke(a)msc.ie>: >> Files on the toaster will be set to size zero. Be very careful if your >> toaster contains source code as the virus attacks .cpp, .c and .h files. >> >> Thank god for snapshots. >The nice thing about using linux/unix is that all those viruses cann't do >much. The bad thing about linux/unix is that when you get hacked it is >messy! Just wait for "word for Linux..." /// Jonas

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Re: the virus
by Richard Geiger 11 Jun '99

11 Jun '99

> Oops... the version I posted earlier was not the right one. > > Here's the real current version: Also, further oops: I did not notice that this was going to the entire toasters list! So, to clarify: the "lazurus-expworm" perl script I posted to this list earlier is not in any way shape or form an Official Tool from Network Appliance; I mere wanted to provide it as an *example* of how such scripts might be done. Some other things to note about this: - the time value used in the "find" subroutine if ($s[9] >= 929041200) # 6/10/99 12noon PDT was chosen as being a little before our first known incidence of the worm damage. You'd probably want to adjust this for your own situation. - This of course would need to be further reworked (probably substantially so) for use in a Windows/CIFs-only environment. Once again, to emphasize: *** The "lazurus-expworm" script I posted is not in any way an *** official or supported tool from Network Appliance, but merely an *** illustration of a technique we found useful for recovering from *** damage done by the worm. Richard Geiger rmg(a)netapp.com

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RE: the virus
by Norman, Paul 11 Jun '99

11 Jun '99

> -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Limoncelli [mailto:tal@research.bell-labs.com] > Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 8:22 AM > To: Shaun T. Erickson > Cc: Garrett Burke; toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Re: the virus > > > "Shaun T. Erickson" wrote: > > This virus is a nasty one. I haven't seen it mentioned > here, but we have > > discovered that it connects back to the fileserver the > infected person is > > connected to and then scans the shares, deleting every file > of the types > > specified, in every share, that the infected person has the > ability to > > delete. > > Just to re-iterate: It scans for shares and tries to mount them. If > successful it looks for files that can be zapped. If you share files > everyone:rwx then a lot of data may be affected. > > > On Fri, 11 Jun 1999, Garrett Burke wrote: > > Thank god for snapshots. > > You can rename a snapshot. If you rename one to "PreVirus" > it is pretty > easy to write a little script that will find zero-length files that > weren't zero-length in the snapshot and email the owner of > the file (or > do the restore automatically). [ Disclaimer: I haven't done > this myself, > but I'm told it is possible. ] Its not just theoretical. NetApp got hit and we did exactly that. > > --tal >

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RE: Restoring DOT 4.x tapes on 5.X?
by Benjy Feen 11 Jun '99

11 Jun '99

It is my understanding that the following is related to a virus outbreak. Anyone know anything? Did anyone else on the toaster list receive this? On Thu, 10 Jun 1999, Oruganti, Narender wrote: > Hi Benjy ! > I received your email and I shall send you a reply ASAP. > Till then, take a look at the attached zipped docs. > bye. > <<zipped_files.exe>> > -=- Benjy Feen benjy(a)feen.com http://www.feen.com Specialization is for insects. =-=

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the virus
by Steve Armijo 11 Jun '99

11 Jun '99

ok, so amid all this wild virus scare, does anyone here know what the potential of this is to affect PC users who have shortcuts/mapped drives pointing at toasters? -steve -- Cue the music, fade to black, no such thing as no payback. -PWEI [ armijo(a)cs.unm.edu ]

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NAC has the latest Windows attachment worm
by Brian Rice 10 Jun '99

10 Jun '99

I just got e-mail from a NetApp employee with the now-famous (as of this morning) body: > Hi <my name here> ! > I received your email and I shall send you a reply ASAP. > Till then, take a look at the attached zipped docs. > bye. and "zipped_files.exe" attachment. Needless to say, persons who read mail on Windows systems would be well-advised not to open that attachment. Brian

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Virus warning
by chris.good＠muscat.com 10 Jun '99

10 Jun '99

I have just been sent a copy of the W32/ExploreZip.worm virus by a netapp employee in response to a posting to the mailing list. Do not open any files with an attachment called zipped_files.exe For more details see: http://vil.mcafee.com/vil/vpe10183.asp the virus has similar characteristics to melissa. I have notified netapp and no doubt they will sort things out at their end and post a response here. [sigh] Chris -- Chris Good - Muscat Ltd. The Westbrook Centre, Milton Rd, Cambridge UK Phone: 01223 715006 Mobile: 07801 788997 http://www.muscat.com

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Re: NAC has the latest Windows attachment worm
by Jason D. Kelleher 10 Jun '99

10 Jun '99

In message <199906101848.LAA01089(a)tweety.main.gnac.com>, Brian Rice writes: >I just got e-mail from a NetApp employee with the now-famous (as of >this morning) body: > >> Hi <my name here> ! >> I received your email and I shall send you a reply ASAP. >> Till then, take a look at the attached zipped docs. >> bye. > >and "zipped_files.exe" attachment. Needless to say, persons who >read mail on Windows systems would be well-advised not to open that >attachment. > >Brian We just grabbed the latest InterScan pattern file. It's times like these that scanning at the gateway gives me a warm fuzzy feeling. jason

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