toasters

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13515 discussions

RE: LISA Conference (NetApp reception)
by Benn, Paul 04 Nov '99

04 Nov '99

Hey gang.... I just heard from the guy that does our shows: NetApp will be having a reception on Tuesday evening from 8-12 at the Schooners bar in the Sheraton. Have Fun! Paul Benn Network Appliance -----Original Message----- From: Benjy Feen [mailto:benjy@feen.com] Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 10:47 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: LISA Conference On 3 Nov 1999, Darrell Fuhriman wrote: > How 'bout just get tanked? I'd like to support this proposal. As many of you know, there are a number of bars on Pine St. They're uphill from the convention center, so the return trip will be on gravity-assist. I'd like to recommend to NetApp that they take steps to provide enhanced beverage throughput for this year's hospitality suite. 1. More blenders (N + 1 blenders?) 2. A caching system; just like DLT tape operations, beverage production is most efficient when given the opportunity to continue streaming despite momentary breaks in demand. The cache also helps minimize the impact of the high-latency nature of pina colada/margarita blending. 3. Hopefully, metrics from last year were saved in order to provide for predictive engineering. -- Benjy Feen | benjy(a)feen.com | http://www.monkeybagel.com

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Re: LISA Conference
by Darrell Fuhriman 04 Nov '99

04 Nov '99

fubar(a)mathworks.com (Kendall Libby) writes: > We could get tanked and then go raid the Auspex party. EMC, too, if > they actually have a party/BOF. ;-) How 'bout just get tanked? :) I doubt Auspex could afford a party, what with practically no new income. :-| I'm making my local netapp reps pony up some more drink tickets, and trying to get him to get some Netapp t-shirts that aren't white for once. :) Glad to see you'll be there, Kendall. :) Darrell

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Re: LISA Conference
by Arvind K Aggarwal 04 Nov '99

04 Nov '99

Sure I would not minding joining in. > Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:37:04 -0800 (PST) > From: Cheryl Cruddace <cruddace(a)feather.llnl.gov> > Subject: Re: LISA Conference > To: toasters(a)mathworks.com > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-MD5: H3IvMA27rXQ5e1ulAi/rYA== > > > I asked whether anyone was going to LISA a few months ago and a few > beer drinkers answered affirmatively. Is anyone still interested in > getting together for a bar-hopping-birds-of-a-feather. If so there > is usually a bulletin board that we could post to at the conference > center. Mind you this is all in the interest of sharing priceless > tidbits of technical information so that I can go home and rip open > those boxes and build our new F740's with gusto and a lot more knowhow > than when I built the F630. (My boss doesn't know that the filers > build and run themselves so he thinks I am on a fact finding mission!) > > Cheryl Cruddace > LLNL Thank You Arvind Aggarwal Network Solutions Sector 1421 West Shure Drive, 3A4 Arlington Heights, IL 60004 (847) 435-9665 (847) 632-6658 (Fax) qa1162(a)email.mot.com

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Doubled directory sizes
by tkaczma＠gryf.net 04 Nov '99

04 Nov '99

Could someone point me to a piece of documentation which explains why the directory files double in size between say Auspex and the NetApp? One of my users is complaining that now that we moved his directory all of the directory files doubled in size overnight. Tom

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Re: Doubled directory sizes
by dnb＠ccs.neu.edu 03 Nov '99

03 Nov '99

Howdy- The other, less likely possibility is that this user had sparse files that got filled in because the copy program couldn't/didn't cope with it. Much less probable than the other block size theories, though. Peace, dNb

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Re: Java Thread & TimeDaemon
by Sam Cramer 02 Nov '99

02 Nov '99

> I've been running 5.3.2R1 since Aug 12th, and I had set up the timed to : > > timed.enable on > timed.log off > timed.max_skew 2s > timed.proto ntp > timed.sched hourly > timed.servers 205.246.15.5 > > Today, I started seeing in my syslogs : > > ..... Tue Nov 2 10:10:42 CST [Java Thread]: TimeDaemon: NTP server > '205.246.15.5' reports that the time is Tue Nov 02 10:14:45 CST 1999, > > for both of the toasters. Anyone know what this is about? these toasters > have been up for around 40 days or so... The syslog messages result from a misunderstanding regarding the meaning of the "timed.max_skew" option. Looking at the name of the option, one could reasonably assume that it controls how far out of whack we'll let the filer's notion of time get before we synchronize with the time server. In fact, it controls how far out of whack a timer server's time can be before the filer will no longer synchronize with the timer server. We use this field to prevent "time poisoning" of the filer by a grossly inaccurate time server. If we had it to do over again, we'd probably change the name of this option to something less confusing. So, when you specified "options timed.max_skew 2s", you were actually saying "if the time reported by the time server is more than 2 seconds away from the filer's notion of the correct time, don't synchronize to the time server." You can eliminate these messages, and get the filers back into synch with the time server by setting "timed.max_skew" to something like 30 minutes (30m). Sam

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Java Thread & TimeDaemon
by Jay Orr 02 Nov '99

02 Nov '99

Huh.... I've been running 5.3.2R1 since Aug 12th, and I had set up the timed to : timed.enable on timed.log off timed.max_skew 2s timed.proto ntp timed.sched hourly timed.servers 205.246.15.5 Today, I started seeing in my syslogs : ..... Tue Nov 2 10:10:42 CST [Java Thread]: TimeDaemon: NTP server '205.246.15.5' reports that the time is Tue Nov 02 10:14:45 CST 1999, for both of the toasters. Anyone know what this is about? these toasters have been up for around 40 days or so... ----------- Jay Orr Systems Administrator Fujitsu Nexion Inc. St. Louis, MO

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Re: General VIF questions
by Sam Cramer 01 Nov '99

01 Nov '99

Menachem> Hi, We don't "yet" have clustered systems, so maybe my question Menachem> is a bit off, but how do you read a partners /et/rc file in the Menachem> event of a crash - are they mirrored to each other? If so how Menachem> does this mechanism work? The disks are dual-ported, so each node has access to the partner's disks. Check out http://www.netapp.com/products/filer/clusters.html and http://www.netapp.com/tech_library/1004.html for more details on Netapp's clustering technology. Sam

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"quota report" for users
by Brian Tao 01 Nov '99

01 Nov '99

Is there any plans to have "quota report" only look up and display a single user? I know you can do it for quota trees, but not for user or group quotas (according to the 5.2 and 5.3 man pages). I have this in my /etc/quotas file: /www1 tree 20g 1m /www2 tree 20g 1m * user@www1 1g * user@www2 1g I know about using the "quota" command from a UNIX NFS client, but that has some drawbacks (only seeing filesystems it has mounted, output formatting problems on Solaris, not being able to specify a particular mount point, etc.). I'd rather ask the filer how much disk space and inodes are owned by a giving uid, without having to go through the entire "quota report" listing (currently at 5500 lines and growing). -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob(a)risc.org) "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't"

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Re: General VIF questions
by Sam Cramer 01 Nov '99

01 Nov '99

I wrote: > When a node takes over for its partner, it reads the partner's /etc/rc > file. The ifconfig commands are processed specially: they are examined > for a "partner" clause. If a partner clause is found, the interface > named in the partner clause takes over for the interface specified in the > ifconfig command. If no partner clause is found, the ifconfig command is > ignored. Whoops --- not enough caffeine! As tkaczma points out, this is exactly backwards: the partner clause is processed by the node destined to take over. Partner mappings (records which define which partner interface the local interface will take over for) --- are recorded at that time. When the node takes over its partner, the partner /etc/rc is run; partner ifconfig statements are matched with the partner mappings in order to determine which local interface will takeover for the partner interface or address in question. Sam

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FW: crossover gigabit
by Francett, Robert D (SAIC) 29 Oct '99

29 Oct '99

fyi... > ---------- > From: Francett, Robert D (SAIC) > Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 10:55 AM > To: 'Graham C. Knight' > Subject: RE: crossover gigabit > > Graham, > > We had to turn-on auto negotiate on our filer for the Gb connect to work. > This in the rc file too to ensure @ reboot. > #Turn-on auto negotiate > rc_toggle_basic > alttune 0 LinkNegotiation 1 > rc_toggle_basic > # > Regards, > Bob Francett > BP Exploration (Alaska) > > ---------- > From: Graham C. Knight[SMTP:grahamk@ast.lmco.com] > Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 6:54 AM > To: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: crossover gigabit > > > Does anyone know of any cheat sheets for setting up > a dedicated crossover gigabit ethernet between a filer > and an HP-UX system? > > I've gotten as far as a good link light, but cannot get > a ping to work. > > Thx, > Graham > >

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crossover gigabit
by Graham C. Knight 29 Oct '99

29 Oct '99

Does anyone know of any cheat sheets for setting up a dedicated crossover gigabit ethernet between a filer and an HP-UX system? I've gotten as far as a good link light, but cannot get a ping to work. Thx, Graham

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Is there a way to backup a specific snapshot...?
by Eyal Traitel 28 Oct '99

28 Oct '99

Hi! Does anybody know of a way to backup a specific snapshot using NDMP ? We're using 5.3.2 and up, Veritas NetBackup 3.11 and 3.2 Does anybody have experience with backuping Atria ClearCase ? I know there's a NOW article on that... Eyal.

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Re: General VIF questions
by Sam Cramer 26 Oct '99

26 Oct '99

tkaczma> This is because I think that you cannot use IP addreses with trunk tkaczma> interfaces. At least you couldn't do it last time I set up tkaczma> "multi" trunking on a new rev of DOT. Right --- for vifs, partners must be specified by interface name, not IP address. Sam

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Re: General VIF questions
by Sam Cramer 26 Oct '99

26 Oct '99

cramer> Which interface takes over is specified using the "ifconfig" cramer> "partner" clause. Please note that vif partners MUST be specified cramer> using the interface name (e.g. vif0), not the interface address cramer> (e.g. 172.27.5.50). This was not clearly spelled out in the cramer> documentation, and it has tripped up a number of people. Brian> Hrm, I'm not sure what you mean by using the interface address Brian> instead of the IP address. If I just give the partner the VIF name, Brian> how does it know what IP to use? Is that stored on the mailbox Brian> disk? When a node takes over for its partner, it reads the partner's /etc/rc file. The ifconfig commands are processed specially: they are examined for a "partner" clause. If a partner clause is found, the interface named in the partner clause takes over for the interface specified in the ifconfig command. If no partner clause is found, the ifconfig command is ignored. Sam

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General VIF questions
by Brian Tao 26 Oct '99

26 Oct '99

I have two clustered pairs of F740's arriving soon, so I will likely be able to discover answers to most of my questions, but I figured I'd do a bit of legwork and check my assumptions while I'm still in the planning stages. I'll consider just one of the clustered pairs: nfs1 and nfs2. Both will be equipped with two QFE NIC's. They will connect to a pair of switches with an uplink between them (i.e., passing traffic between two hosts on the same subnet, but on different switches). Logically, consider it a single switch. Each Netapp will be visible on two subnets: 10.35.8.0/25 and 10.35.8.128/25. NFS clients in one subnet will not be able to see filer interfaces in the other. I want to create two single-mode VIF's on each filer, using four interfaces on each filer: ====Active VIF_Subnet1====[e1a] [e2a]----Standby VIF_Subnet1--- ----Standby VIF_Subnet2---[e1b] [e2b]====Active VIF_Subnet2==== ..........Unused..........[e1c] [e2c]..........Unused.......... ..........Unused..........[e1d] [e2d]..........Unused.......... Trunks are created across NIC's. Ports on e1 are cabled to switch 1, and ports on e2 are cabled to switch 2. Since this is a single- mode trunk, the switches shouldn't care, right? During normal operation, switch 1 only sees an active port from e1a, and switch 2 only sees an active port from e2b (since e2a and e1b are effectively "downed" interfaces). While it would be a bit less confusing to say "all interfaces on e1 are active, and all interfaces on e2 are on standby", I prefer to have an active interface on each NIC at all times. This should lessen the chance of Murphy's Law kicking in on an early Sunday morning when e1 does fail, only to reveal that e2 had also died quietly sometime before then. I also want those same physical interfaces to assume their partner's VIF configuration in a failover situation (i.e., what the manual calls "shared interface takover"). So this is what I have, based on the 5.3.2 documentation: nfs1> vif create single VIF_Subnet1 e1a e2a nfs1> vif create single VIF_Subnet2 e2b e1b nfs1> vif favor e1a nfs1> vif favor e2b nfs1> ifconfig VIF_Subnet1 10.35.8.1 netmask 255.255.255.128 partner 10.35.8.2 nfs1> ifconfig VIF_Subnet2 10.35.8.129 netmask 255.255.255.128 partner 10.35.8.130 nfs2> vif create single VIF_Subnet1 e1a e2a nfs2> vif create single VIF_Subnet2 e2b e1b nfs2> vif favor e1a nfs2> vif favor e2b nfs2> ifconfig VIF_Subnet1 10.35.8.2 netmask 255.255.255.128 partner 10.35.8.1 nfs2> ifconfig VIF_Subnet2 10.35.8.130 netmask 255.255.255.128 partner 10.35.8.129 This configuration should be able to withstand failure of a filer NIC port, a filer NIC, an Ethernet cable, a switch port, an entire switch and an entire filer. Certain combinations of double failures are also non-lethal. Since this is all theoretical (to me, anyway), I have some questions. :) What characters are allowed in a VIF name? Is anyone using single-mode VIF's across two different switches like this? How does the Netapp know which VIF to use with the "vif favor" command? I assume this means a physical interface can only participate in one VIF at a time. Is it possible to prioritize interfaces in a VIF with more than two ports trunked together? Can VIF's be shared in a cluster? Can they share ports as above? Special mention is only made about super VIF's and clustering in the 5.3.2 SAG. Can super VIF's be created from single-mode VIF's, or only multi-mode VIF's? Again, the manual only mentions the latter, but does not prohibit the former. Can super VIF's themselves be multi-mode, or single-mode only? I'll post the results of my configuration testing once I have the hardware to play with. -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob(a)risc.org) "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't"

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dlt8000 supported?
by Luke Mewburn 26 Oct '99

26 Oct '99

Hi All. Is the DLT-8000 supported in OnTap? I've been quoted a price on a DLT-8000 that is A$100 more than a DLT-7000, and when you're paying nearly A$8000 for a tape drive that seems like a good deal to me. Hopefully a DLT-8000 should act like a DLT-7000 given the same tape density SCSI control codes. I'd rather spend a little bit more money now for a drive with 12.5% more capacity, even if I have to wait for a newer release to get that extra density. Luke.

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Re: mailboxes on toaster
by Jim McCoy 26 Oct '99

26 Oct '99

George Kahler wrote: >Q: Will mbx buy me performance on the toaster ? >Q: Is Maildir a better choice ? As in all difficult questions the answer is "it depends." People have given some very good reasons on why maildir is an appropriate choice given certain constraints, so let me mention a few things that favor mbox-format mail storage on a filer. We run several tens of millions of user mailboxes on a fleet of NetApps for YahooMail and so here are a few other points to consider that we have run into over the past few years: 1) Locking is a dead issue for mbox. There is no way to adequately provide file locking via the standard channels so you will probably need to deal with the locking issue as a seperate problem. We ended up writing our own mailbox locking system but you might be able to use procmail for as your local delivery agent and let that try to figure out the locking issues. Locking is important, but do not fixate on this issue and ignore all of the other points that you need to consider. 2) Inode cost should not be overlooked. You get at most 32 million per volume, so if you have a lot of mailboxes a maildir or other one-file-per-message scheme will chew through your inode limit long before you run out of disk space on that volume. To compensate you will have to make smaller volumes. This is not necessarily a bad thing but each volume will be at least one additional raid group and on additional wasted parity disk (increased cost/mailbox). The larger number of inodes in use will also increase the time it takes your filer to complete a wack run and will have an impact on backup speeds. 3) Mail messages are small. There is a simple bimodal distribution to internet mail message size, they are either very small or very large. The small files will cost you storage bits because the filer uses 4K to store each 500byte message. The small file sizes will also keep your read chain length very low so we will get significantly decreased performance on your backups of this volume and you will notice some decreased read performance on the filer in general. jim

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Re: mailboxes on toaster
by jrg＠gbnet.net 25 Oct '99

25 Oct '99

On Mon 25 Oct, 1999, "Luke Gain" <luke(a)erinet.com> wrote: >one thing I found to be a big win is to make sure all the filenames are 12 >characters >or less. evidentally, the netapp only caches names that are <12 characters >long. >so if the name is >12 characters it takes a disk-op to read the directory. I expect it'll interact with your operating system, too (or this may actually be the sole cause.) Eg. Solaris puts namei lookup results in the DNLC (directory name lookup cache) only if they're under a certain size (vmstat -s shows these as "toolong"), so if you've got long directory paths you would expect to see a problem not dissimilar to the one you describe. On the subject of the DNLC, beware of making it too big as that has been bad for performance too. ("classic" BSD sets this "toolong" constant NCHNAMLEN at 31. FreeBSD-current seems to have done away with it.) James.

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Re: General VIF questions
by Sam Cramer 25 Oct '99

25 Oct '99

>>>>> "Brian" == Brian Tao <taob(a)risc.org> writes: Brian> Since this is all theoretical (to me, anyway), I have some Brian> questions. :) Brian> What characters are allowed in a VIF name? A vif name may be composed of any non-blank characters and should begin with a letter. The name may be at most 15 characters long. Brian> Is anyone using single-mode VIF's across two different switches like Brian> this? Yes. We have a number of customers who use single-mode vifs composed of links attached to two different switches to protect against switch failure. Brian> How does the Netapp know which VIF to use with the "vif favor" Brian> command? I assume this means a physical interface can only Brian> participate in one VIF at a time. Yes, an interface (physical or virtual) can only participate in one vif at a time. Brian> Is it possible to prioritize interfaces in a VIF with more than two Brian> ports trunked together? If you're asking "can you favor a link in a single-mode VIF composed of more than 2 links", the answer is yes. If you're asking "can I specify secondary, tertiary (and so on) priority for links in a single-mode VIF", the answer is no: only one link may be favored; all others are equally "non-favored". Brian> Can VIF's be shared in a cluster? Can they share ports as above? Brian> Special mention is only made about super VIF's and clustering in the Brian> 5.3.2 SAG. vifs can't be shared across a cluster. However, the surviving node may takeover for a vif just like it may takeover for other interfaces. Which interface takes over is specified using the "ifconfig" "partner" clause. Please note that vif partners MUST be specified using the interface name (e.g. vif0), not the interface address (e.g. 172.27.5.50). This was not clearly spelled out in the documentation, and it has tripped up a number of people. Brian> Can super VIF's be created from single-mode VIF's, or only Brian> multi-mode VIF's? Again, the manual only mentions the latter, but Brian> does not prohibit the former. Super vifs may be created from single-mode vifs or multi-mode vifs. I'm not sure why you would want to create a super-vif from single-mode vifs, though. Brian> Can super VIF's themselves be multi-mode, or single-mode only? Single mode only. Sam

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We Need Homeworkers!!
by mowooco＠mindspring.com 25 Oct '99

25 Oct '99

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a recent caching company bugid ticket info
by Colin Johnston 22 Oct '99

22 Oct '99

For a good Friday night read :) Title Some customers would like our apppliances to be more groovy Problem It was noted by a customer that the design of our caches wasn't groovy enough. They would like the caches to glow and blink. Stackability and the ability to use the server as a die in Dungeons & Dragons games was also mentioned. Workaround You can currently customize the "groovability" of the cache with third party add ons from http://www.legomindstorms.com/ . Your imagination and pocketbook are your only limitations. Colin Johnston SA PSINET UK

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Source for a non-root quota program?
by James Deibele 21 Oct '99

21 Oct '99

We would like our support people to be able to do real-time quota verification for customers, meaning that support person A is able to tell customer B that they're using 9.688MB of their 10MB quota. Having gone that far, we would actually really like to have a web page for our non-UNIX customers to check their usage. We can't use the normal /usr/ucb/quota program that comes with Solaris because it requires you to run as root to check someone else's usage. If we try to use suexec or cgiwrap to run programs as the user, we will have to make a copy of the script for every customer. This is sub-optimal. So what we want is a program (Solaris preferred, Linux or NT might be acceptable) that will allow any user to check the total usage for any other user. Seems like this would have come up with other people using NetApps extensively. Does NetApp have an official program that does this? Possibly a program that someone has contributed?

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Re: Source for a non-root quota program?
by dnb＠ccs.neu.edu 20 Oct '99

20 Oct '99

I've not tried this as non-root, but there is a Perl module which can do all sort of good quota stuff for you. It can be found at: http://search.cpan.org/search?module=Quota Peace, dNb

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Re: Easiest way to migrate data off of Filer
by dnb＠ccs.neu.edu 20 Oct '99

20 Oct '99

Bennett Todd <bet(a)mordor.net> writes: > If you have the GNU findutils first on your PATH (which I always recommend > doing), you can use > cd /src;find dir -depth -print0|cpio -p0dm /dst Quick note about this: unless you have patched it, the find command will pick up the .snapshot dirs as well. There was a patch posted to this list a while back. If anyone can't find in the archives, drop me a note and I'll send it along. It works really well (we replaced our default install of GNU find with a patched version because it works so well). Peace, dNb

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