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13515 discussions

RE: LTO support?
by Collie, Michael 14 Mar '01

14 Mar '01

>From your mail, some library vendors are apparently advance in having LTO solutions. We will raise this, as a question to some of the first tier library vendors that we are partnering with that doesn't yet have LTO solutions. Thanks for the information. Michael. -----Original Message----- From: Moshe Linzer [mailto:Moshe.Linzer@nsc.com] Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 11:40 PM To: Steve Vawter Cc: Michael.Collie(a)netapp.com; ryanb(a)enteract.com; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: LTO support? IBM is offering 2 library models with up to 6 Ultrium drives. Qualstar also has a few models available with LTO. Moshe Steve Vawter wrote: > I already have 1 vendor willing to admit that they have a library > that can either be pure LTO or else 1/2 LTO, 1/2 SDLT (heding their > bets). I believe that they are actually already taking orders and > supposedly shipping these units. > > In no way should you take this as a testimonial, but here is the info: > Overland Data > www.overlanddata.com > > Steve Vawter voice: 408-490-5310 fax: 408-490-8615 > Staff UNIX Systems Administrator Steve.Vawter(a)C-Cube.COM > > --> > --> From Michael.Collie(a)netapp.com Mon Mar 12 15:06:31 2001 > --> From: "Collie, Michael" <Michael.Collie(a)netapp.com> > --> To: Moshe Linzer <Moshe.Linzer(a)nsc.com> > --> Cc: "'ryanb'" <ryanb(a)enteract.com>, toasters(a)mathworks.com > --> Subject: RE: LTO support? > --> X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) > --> > --> Moshe, > --> > --> The LTO technology promises performance of up to 30Mb/s with 2:1 > --> compression. This performance far exceeds DLTs, SDLT, ATI-2 and 9840s. The > --> form factor for LTO (Ultrium) is different for today's tape drives. > --> > --> It may be some time before library vendors integrate the LTO technology into > --> their products. NetApp support for LTO is slated for 4th quarter of 2001. > --> > --> > --> ---Original Message----- > --> From: ryanb [mailto:ryanb@enteract.com] > --> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 12:58 PM > --> To: Moshe Linzer > --> Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com > --> Subject: Re: LTO support? > --> > --> On Mon, Mar 12, 2001 at 09:17:57PM +0200, Moshe Linzer wrote: > --> > Does anyone know when LTO will be supported on the filer? I have two > --> > 760's, and we are shopping around for a backup library. I am hesitant > --> > to go with LTO at this point, but management likes the numbers. Can > --> > anyone share experience or opinions on LTO drives or libraries? > --> > --> Most LTO equipment is identical to DLT equipment, only with a different > --> tape drive. In this respect, the LTO drives will perform identically, or > --> so I'd like to think. ;) Please let me know if I'm wrong here. > --> > --> - ryan > --> -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - Moshe Linzer | On the Internet, Unix Systems Manager | National Semiconductor, Israel | nobody knows you're a moron. Phone: 972-9-970-2247 | Fax: 972-9-970-2001 | - Network Magazine Email: moshel(a)nsc.com | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -

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non-LVD Differential SCSI card for F7xx
by Rob Windsor 14 Mar '01

14 Mar '01

We've been told buy our sales rep that NetApp doesn't sell non-LVD PCI Differential-SCSI cards. Is this true? If so, it is *really* going to cramp our style. :P Rob++ ---------------------------------------- Rob Windsor E-Mail - mailto:rob_windsor@adc.com Senior Unix Systems Administrator Voice - phone:972-680-6919 Computer Services Fax - phone:972-680-0370 Broadband Access and Transport Group __o ADC Telecommunications _`\<,_ Richardson, TX 75082 (_)/ (_)

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RE: Tape autoloader with F760
by Cormier, Darleen 14 Mar '01

14 Mar '01

There is no command to rescan the SCSI bus, so yes, you will have to reboot the filer. Please be sure that the drives in the library are supported in the version of DataONTAP you are using. -----Original Message----- From: netapp-list [mailto:netapp-list@tiscali.be] Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2001 8:37 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Tape autoloader with F760 Hi all, I would like to use a Hexabyte 17D autoloader on F760 Cluster, but I don't know how to make it detected by the filer. Is there a command to rescan the SCSI bus or does I've to reboot the filer ? Thanks.

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Tape autoloader with F760
by netapp-list 14 Mar '01

14 Mar '01

Hi all, I would like to use a Hexabyte 17D autoloader on F760 Cluster, but I don't know how to make it detected by the filer. Is there a command to rescan the SCSI bus or does I've to reboot the filer ? Thanks.

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NFS version 4
by Chris Thompson 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

Now that NFS version 4 has got as far as a complete specification in an RFC (RFC 3010, December 2000), would it be too much like tweaking the Devil's tail to inquire about NetApp's plans with respect to it? I can't find anything on NOW, but perhaps I shouldn't expect to... Of course, we are probably still years away from usable client implementations. Chris Thompson University of Cambridge Computing Service, Email: cet1(a)ucs.cam.ac.uk New Museums Site, Cambridge CB2 3QG, Phone: +44 1223 334715 United Kingdom.

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RE: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer
by George Kahler 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

I would like to express my thanks to all of the people that have responded to my Oracle query and have showed me the way ... :-) I was not aware of the Oracle SID which makes things much more easier to implement. As many of you mentioned it looks like I only need one oracle account on each server I want Oracle to run on and then 'share' this account amongst all of the database instances setting the proper environment based on the SID. Many thanks, George

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Legato/NetApp/NDMP/restore woes
by jlbreyfo＠collins.rockwell.com 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

Toasters, I'm new to the group and don't know about archives and such. Please excuse if this is an old question. Is anybody backing up using Legato 6.0.1 patch 1 (approx. 300GB vols) and ndmp. I have sporadic problems backing up, actually finishing the index - backup works fine; and also have problems restoring files, i.e. I have to relocate a selected file with a path like: filername::/vol/user1/username/restored/. Seems a bit hokey to me and I get no good info from Legato. I would love to discuss my problems and your solutions. Thanks in advance John Breyfogle Unix Admin Rockwell-Collins jlbreyfo(a)collins.rockwell.com

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RE: F740 with F760 spare
by Clawson, Simon 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

I am told that the footprint is different. This stops resourceful people buying a 760 spares kit and upgrading thier cheaper 740. But I am not sure about any of the other parts. I had a Unisys engineer here once who fitted 700 series Eth. Adpators to a 500..it did'nt work, but the machine did'nt blow up either ;-) Simon > -----Original Message----- > From: max chan [mailto:maxchan0@yahoo.com] > Sent: Tuesday March 2001 03:34 > To: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: F740 with F760 spare > > > Did anyone try to put F760 spare in F740? > > Max > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. > http://auctions.yahoo.com/ >

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RE: LTO support?
by Joe Luchtenberg 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

I think what Ryan was referring to was much more superficial than you are describing. And I've heard the same thing -- i.e. LTO2 and DLT drives share the same form factor, drive cages, cabling/ports, media form factor, etc. All in pointed contrast to AIT2. Although not as significant as MTBF or product maturity, these are nonetheless not trivial issues. Joe Joe Luchtenberg Dataline, Inc. New number and email, please update: 757.858.0600 858.0606 fax joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Stringer, Douglas [SMTP:Douglas.Stringer@netapp.com] > Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 5:27 PM > To: 'ryanb'; Moshe Linzer > Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: RE: LTO support? > > Don't let the LTO manufactures hear you say that. > With different driver support, media, ISV certification requirements and > specifications that are anything but similar to DLT, the only common item > these formats share is that they are 'linear' tape formats. > > NetApp will be supporting LTO in the late summer/early fall timeframe. > > Regards, > Doug Stringer > > -----Original Message----- > From: ryanb [mailto:ryanb@enteract.com] > Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 12:58 PM > To: Moshe Linzer > Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Re: LTO support? > > > On Mon, Mar 12, 2001 at 09:17:57PM +0200, Moshe Linzer wrote: > > Does anyone know when LTO will be supported on the filer? I have two > > 760's, and we are shopping around for a backup library. I am hesitant > > to go with LTO at this point, but management likes the numbers. Can > > anyone share experience or opinions on LTO drives or libraries? > > Most LTO equipment is identical to DLT equipment, only with a different > tape drive. In this respect, the LTO drives will perform identically, or > so I'd like to think. ;) Please let me know if I'm wrong here. > > - ryan

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RE: LTO support?
by svawter＠c-cube.com 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

I already have 1 vendor willing to admit that they have a library that can either be pure LTO or else 1/2 LTO, 1/2 SDLT (heding their bets). I believe that they are actually already taking orders and supposedly shipping these units. In no way should you take this as a testimonial, but here is the info: Overland Data www.overlanddata.com Steve Vawter voice: 408-490-5310 fax: 408-490-8615 Staff UNIX Systems Administrator Steve.Vawter(a)C-Cube.COM --> --> From Michael.Collie(a)netapp.com Mon Mar 12 15:06:31 2001 --> From: "Collie, Michael" <Michael.Collie(a)netapp.com> --> To: Moshe Linzer <Moshe.Linzer(a)nsc.com> --> Cc: "'ryanb'" <ryanb(a)enteract.com>, toasters(a)mathworks.com --> Subject: RE: LTO support? --> X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) --> --> Moshe, --> --> The LTO technology promises performance of up to 30Mb/s with 2:1 --> compression. This performance far exceeds DLTs, SDLT, ATI-2 and 9840s. The --> form factor for LTO (Ultrium) is different for today's tape drives. --> --> It may be some time before library vendors integrate the LTO technology into --> their products. NetApp support for LTO is slated for 4th quarter of 2001. --> --> --> ---Original Message----- --> From: ryanb [mailto:ryanb@enteract.com] --> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 12:58 PM --> To: Moshe Linzer --> Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com --> Subject: Re: LTO support? --> --> On Mon, Mar 12, 2001 at 09:17:57PM +0200, Moshe Linzer wrote: --> > Does anyone know when LTO will be supported on the filer? I have two --> > 760's, and we are shopping around for a backup library. I am hesitant --> > to go with LTO at this point, but management likes the numbers. Can --> > anyone share experience or opinions on LTO drives or libraries? --> --> Most LTO equipment is identical to DLT equipment, only with a different --> tape drive. In this respect, the LTO drives will perform identically, or --> so I'd like to think. ;) Please let me know if I'm wrong here. --> --> - ryan -->

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F740 with F760 spare
by max chan 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

Did anyone try to put F760 spare in F740? Max __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

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ender: owner-toasters@mathworks.com
by Darren Dunham 13 Mar '01

13 Mar '01

> > Please correct me. > > When ipv4 networik interfaces are initialized by /etc/init.d/network thru > /etc/hostname.xyz, First of all, we have to be sure that we're talking about Solaris 8 here. It appears the startup scripts have had some name changes... > 1. if /etc/hostname.zyz has more than one lines, each line will be > configured for that interface with > /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet param-string > with param-string is the content of the corresponding line. This leads to > the interface is not up, except param-string has the correct format & > contains the keyword "up" > ( for example, the line contains "some-valid-host-name up" ) Sure.. > 2. If /etc/hostname.xyz.has only one line, the interface will be init as > /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet param-string netmask + broadcast + up. > In this case, the param-string is often the hostname. > --- > > So if /etc/hostname.xyz has 3 lines, we will have > /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line1 > /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line2 > /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line3 Actually, it would be... /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line1 /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line2 /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line3 netmask + broadcast + up *unless* the last line is blank. If the last line is blank then it becomes... /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line1 /sbin/ifconfig xyz inet line2 Line 3 is dropped entirely.. > Why do we need this multi-line process like this ? Good question. I couldn't find a particular bug or patch in sunsolve that mentioned this... Also, this multi-line stuff appears to be new in Solaris 8. -- Darren Dunham ddunham(a)taos.com Unix System Administrator Taos - The SysAdmin Company Got some Dr Pepper? San Francisco, CA bay area < How are you gentlemen!! Take off every '.SIG'!! >

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RE: LTO support?
by Stringer, Douglas 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

Don't let the LTO manufactures hear you say that. With different driver support, media, ISV certification requirements and specifications that are anything but similar to DLT, the only common item these formats share is that they are 'linear' tape formats. NetApp will be supporting LTO in the late summer/early fall timeframe. Regards, Doug Stringer -----Original Message----- From: ryanb [mailto:ryanb@enteract.com] Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 12:58 PM To: Moshe Linzer Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: LTO support? On Mon, Mar 12, 2001 at 09:17:57PM +0200, Moshe Linzer wrote: > Does anyone know when LTO will be supported on the filer? I have two > 760's, and we are shopping around for a backup library. I am hesitant > to go with LTO at this point, but management likes the numbers. Can > anyone share experience or opinions on LTO drives or libraries? Most LTO equipment is identical to DLT equipment, only with a different tape drive. In this respect, the LTO drives will perform identically, or so I'd like to think. ;) Please let me know if I'm wrong here. - ryan

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Re: getting dump messages into messages file
by Steve Kappel 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

Jeffrey Krueger wrote: >Moshe: You can create the directory "ndmp" in your netbackup logs directory >(ours is /usr/openv/netbackup/logs, not sure about yours) on the NBU server >to cause it to create the debug logs Steve mentioned. Be forewarned that >they get big fast, and that simultaneous dump processes output is >intermixed forcing you to match the PID on each line to the bptm process >for the backup you are interested in. NBU NDMP debug info is also >intermixed, so you'll want to look for lines that match this: > ><date> <time> [<bptm PID>]-Log:<dump/restore output from filer> By default the ndmp logs should only have error messages. But avrd polls all UP and free devices every 15 seconds or so and not having a NDMP tape mounted results in NDMP_IO_ERR for that. To get more info in there you need a numeric value in the file /usr/openv/volmgr/database/ndmp_debug If you use 65535 it will fill your disk quickly with lots of stuff you aren't interested in. (Not to mention slow things down.) The value is actually a mask constructed of the bits defined in the ndmp.org SDK. I have never tried it but you might get a value of 8192 to put log entries in there without adding a lot of other stuff. If it doesn't do that... like I said, this is an undocumented/unsupported log :) __________________________________________________________________________ Steve Kappel steve.kappel(a)veritas.com VERITAS Software steve.kappel(a)iname.com (Personal)

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RE: LTO support?
by Collie, Michael 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

Moshe, The LTO technology promises performance of up to 30Mb/s with 2:1 compression. This performance far exceeds DLTs, SDLT, ATI-2 and 9840s. The form factor for LTO (Ultrium) is different for today's tape drives. It may be some time before library vendors integrate the LTO technology into their products. NetApp support for LTO is slated for 4th quarter of 2001. ---Original Message----- From: ryanb [mailto:ryanb@enteract.com] Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 12:58 PM To: Moshe Linzer Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: LTO support? On Mon, Mar 12, 2001 at 09:17:57PM +0200, Moshe Linzer wrote: > Does anyone know when LTO will be supported on the filer? I have two > 760's, and we are shopping around for a backup library. I am hesitant > to go with LTO at this point, but management likes the numbers. Can > anyone share experience or opinions on LTO drives or libraries? Most LTO equipment is identical to DLT equipment, only with a different tape drive. In this respect, the LTO drives will perform identically, or so I'd like to think. ;) Please let me know if I'm wrong here. - ryan

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LTO support?
by Moshe Linzer 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

Does anyone know when LTO will be supported on the filer? I have two 760's, and we are shopping around for a backup library. I am hesitant to go with LTO at this point, but management likes the numbers. Can anyone share experience or opinions on LTO drives or libraries? Thanks, Moshe

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RE: getting dump messages into messages file
by Traitel, Eyal 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

You can turn on our own NDMP logging using: ndmpd debug 50 You can control logging only to a file by turning off logging to console ndmpd debug screen This will create files called /etc/ndmplog*, which contains much more than the dump messages, but you can obviously grep it by "dump"... I do not know if it has any performance issues on the dump itself though. Hope it helps, Eyal. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- eTraitel - I'm the new eBuzzword around !!! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Eyal Traitel - Filer Escalation Engineer CNA, MCSE, CSA, NetApp CA Network Appliance BV Holland Office Center Kruisweg 799b 2132 NG, Hoofddorp The Netherlands Office: +31 23 567 9685 Cellular: +31 6 5497 2568 Email: eyal(a)netapp.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Get answers NOW! - NetApp On the Web - http://now.netapp.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -----Original Message----- From: Moshe Linzer [mailto:Moshe.Linzer@nsc.com] Sent: Monday, March 12, 2001 11:40 AM To: Stephen Manley Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: getting dump messages into messages file Stephen Manley wrote: > For now, you either want to capture dump logs by running > via rsh, or if you use an NDMP client, they generally > capture the dump messages in their logs. Does anyone know how to see the NDMP dump output messages from within Legato or Veritas? We have tested both products, but neither allowed us to view the NDMP dump messages like we do in Budtool. We checked all the logs, but maybe there is a logging option that needs to be turned on? Moshe -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - Moshe Linzer | On the Internet, Unix Systems Manager | National Semiconductor, Israel | nobody knows you're a moron. Phone: 972-9-970-2247 | Fax: 972-9-970-2001 | - Network Magazine Email: moshel(a)nsc.com | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -

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logging cifs deletes on F760
by nick.mayrath＠webmd.net 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

Is it possible to log what user is deleting what files on an F760 running 5.3.6r2 and CIFS only? Nick Mayrath ExpressBill, Inc. 800-453-8439 ext. 216

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Re: getting dump messages into messages file
by Steve Kappel 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

Moshe Linzer wrote: >Stephen Manley wrote: > >> For now, you either want to capture dump logs by running >> via rsh, or if you use an NDMP client, they generally >> capture the dump messages in their logs. > >Does anyone know how to see the NDMP dump output messages from within Legato or >Veritas? We have tested both products, but neither allowed us to view the >NDMP dump messages like we do in Budtool. We checked all the logs, but maybe >there is a logging option that needs to be turned on? Current releases of NetBackup NDMP put these messages into the NDMP debugging log which isn't externally supported. Starting with the next major release (fall) they will go into the bptm log and possibly the user log. __________________________________________________________________________ Steve Kappel steve.kappel(a)veritas.com VERITAS Software steve.kappel(a)iname.com (Personal)

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getting dump messages into messages file
by neil lehrer 12 Mar '01

12 Mar '01

hi, i noticed that dump messages were not being recorded in the messages file. i did not have a syslog.conf file so i created one like this: *.* /etc/messages *.* /dev/console no change. am i doing something wrong? f760 ontap 5.36r2. thanks. -- regards

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How are NDMP incrementals so fast?
by Tom "Mad Dog" Yergeau 10 Mar '01

10 Mar '01

Obviously from all the NDMP messages I'm sending this week, we just started using NDMP. :-) I just saw the results of our first incremental NDMP backups and I was flabbergasted at how fast they ran. I even double-checked the logs to make sure it actually was backing stuff up. When doing an incremental backup over CIFS, it would take about three hours to go through about 200 GB of stuff (1.8 million inodes). Doing it with NDMP, it takes 20-30 minutes. That's quite an improvement. It's obvious that when doing an incremental NDMP backup, there is something going on that allows the filer to determine extremely quickly which files have changed since the full backup. Can someone tell us what's going on? Does the filer keep a log of stuff that's changed? Is this just something WAFL is really good at? Thanks! MD

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RE: cluster using F740 and F760
by Traitel, Eyal 10 Mar '01

10 Mar '01

Todd, I cannot answer on behalf of our marketing group etc., but I would see a few obstacles: 1. Partner node needs to take care of both nodes activity in takeover mode, so it cannot be that much lower than other node. 2. We sell active-active clustering, so both nodes are active, and customer is not wasting his money for any passive protection. It leads you to the point that it may not worth the complexity to sell such a setup. 3. Technically, you must have same NVRAM size, and I believe you should also have reasonably close response times for any NVRAM mirroring and general underlying OS activity. That just makes non-equal nodes business more complex than one might think. 4. Anyway - customers reactions are always welcome here, and I'll run this to cluster devel. group, and see if they have to say anything.... Yours, Eyal. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- eTraitel - I'm the new eBuzzword around !!! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Eyal Traitel - Filer Escalation Engineer CNA, MCSE, CSA, NetApp CA Network Appliance BV Holland Office Center Kruisweg 799b 2132 NG, Hoofddorp The Netherlands Office: +31 23 567 9685 Cellular: +31 6 5497 2568 Email: eyal(a)netapp.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Get answers NOW! - NetApp On the Web - http://now.netapp.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -----Original Message----- From: Todd C. Merrill [mailto:tmerrill@mathworks.com] Sent: Friday, March 09, 2001 6:11 PM To: Traitel, Eyal Cc: 'max chan'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: cluster using F740 and F760 From: max chan [mailto:maxchan0@yahoo.com] > Is it possible to use F740 and F760 as a cluster pair? On Mon, 5 Mar 2001, Traitel, Eyal wrote: > No, sorry. > This is unsupported. Ah, but is it *possible*? ;) You can put 1 GB of memory into an F740 to match the 1 GB in an F740. That is unsupported too, but possible. Ask me how I know. So, what's the real reason why it's not supported, clustering two non-exact-but-in-the-same-family filers? Is there something technically preventing it? Is is a marketing/sales decision? Is it to protect the unwashed masses from their own stupidity? Why not allow a lower-end filer take over a higher-end one? You're in a degraded mode in the first place during a failover condition, so why not allow a calculated risk? Until next time... The Mathworks, Inc. 508-647-7000 x7792 3 Apple Hill Drive, Natick, MA 01760-2098 508-647-7001 FAX tmerrill(a)mathworks.com http://www.mathworks.com ---

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RE: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer
by Jennifer Armenta 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Since putting everything on the filer would be ideal it's not a reality as you have stated just in case there is a problem. Im consolidating 6 unix servers running Oracle dbase to 840 filer. I was thinking it would be nice to run the ORACLE_HOME dirs and logs from 2 unix servers rather than 6. Wonder if anyone has thought about consolidating that way or even if it a good idea... -----Original Message----- From: Yarmas, Tom [mailto:Tom.Yarmas@netapp.com] Sent: Friday, March 09, 2001 1:14 PM To: 'Jennifer Armenta'; 'George Kahler'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer > Is there a "best" method for where everything should be for > multi dbases? "Best" method, hmmm. I guess the easy answer is everything on the Filer, and if you need to save some space, have multiple instances share the ORACLE_HOME. But in reality, there are enough variables that it depends on what you are trying to acomplish and how much local storage your database machine has. Typically, I find ORACLE_HOME on the database machine storage, and all of the datafiles, redo logs, etc on the Filer. Often the boot drives are large and mirrored, so there is plenty of space. Plenty being relative ;) Of course this tends to preclude failover in the case of a failed database machine unless a backup machine has an ORACLE_HOME installed on it. And if you duplicate the ORACLE_HOME onto multiple machines for failover, then there is a risk that some change was not propogated to all machines. Of course, having multiple database instances within a single Filer volume has implications on SnapShots and SnapRestore/SnapMirror since these technologies work at the volume level. If you needed to do a SnapRestore for one instance, any others in the same volume would be affected. Similarly, when you take a SnapShot, the SnapShot would be for the entire volume, so it may be worthwhile to have multiple instances down (for a cold backup) or in hot backup mode for a hot backup. You generally do not want to have a seperate volume for each database instance unless they are large databases simply because each volume must have at least one parity disk, and you don't want volumes made up of a small number of drives if you can help it for performance. The only things that need to be on local storage are the alert logs and the trace files directory. That is so that if a connection to the Filer is lost, Oracle can write it's alert info for troubleshooting. If you can't talk to your Filer, you want to be able to see info in the alert log to take action. And if you can't talk to your local disks, you know immediatly. -tom

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RE: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer
by Yarmas, Tom 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

> Is there a "best" method for where everything should be for > multi dbases? "Best" method, hmmm. I guess the easy answer is everything on the Filer, and if you need to save some space, have multiple instances share the ORACLE_HOME. But in reality, there are enough variables that it depends on what you are trying to acomplish and how much local storage your database machine has. Typically, I find ORACLE_HOME on the database machine storage, and all of the datafiles, redo logs, etc on the Filer. Often the boot drives are large and mirrored, so there is plenty of space. Plenty being relative ;) Of course this tends to preclude failover in the case of a failed database machine unless a backup machine has an ORACLE_HOME installed on it. And if you duplicate the ORACLE_HOME onto multiple machines for failover, then there is a risk that some change was not propogated to all machines. Of course, having multiple database instances within a single Filer volume has implications on SnapShots and SnapRestore/SnapMirror since these technologies work at the volume level. If you needed to do a SnapRestore for one instance, any others in the same volume would be affected. Similarly, when you take a SnapShot, the SnapShot would be for the entire volume, so it may be worthwhile to have multiple instances down (for a cold backup) or in hot backup mode for a hot backup. You generally do not want to have a seperate volume for each database instance unless they are large databases simply because each volume must have at least one parity disk, and you don't want volumes made up of a small number of drives if you can help it for performance. The only things that need to be on local storage are the alert logs and the trace files directory. That is so that if a connection to the Filer is lost, Oracle can write it's alert info for troubleshooting. If you can't talk to your Filer, you want to be able to see info in the alert log to take action. And if you can't talk to your local disks, you know immediatly. -tom

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RE: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer
by Jennifer Armenta 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Is there a "best" method for where everything should be for multi dbases? Oracle home on separate server or everything on the filer (database and Oracle home)? -----Original Message----- From: Yarmas, Tom [mailto:Tom.Yarmas@netapp.com] Sent: Friday, March 09, 2001 11:56 AM To: 'George Kahler'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer There are 2 things to keep in mind here. First, there is the oracle account's home directory, and second there is an environment variable known as ORACLE_HOME. These 2 things can be different. ORACLE_HOME used to have to be unique among instances of Oracle, but with OFA in version 8.x, that has been somewhat relaxed. In versions prior to 8.x, it is more difficult for Oracle instances to share the ORACLE_HOME directory (but not impossible, at least not with unix). As a standard practice, I never install the Oracle software in the oracle account's home directory. That way I can put things in the home directory that affect multiple instances (i.e. shell scripts or sql scripts, etc.), and if I have multiple ORACLE_HOME directories then I don't have to copy things around when I make changes. Oracle will look at the ORACLE_HOME and ORACLE_SID environment variables to determine where it should find certain files by default. I have had various Oracle instances share the same ORACLE_HOME directory without consequence. One of the drawbacks of multiple instances sharing the ORACLE_HOME is that if you upgrade from one version of Oracle to another, it affects all of the instances that were using that ORACLE_HOME. That may not be a good outcome. I prefer that each Oracle instance have it's own ORACLE_HOME, if possible. You could of course create multiple oracle user account (i.e. oraprod1, oraprod2, or something more informative) instead of simply oracle. There is nothing magical in the user oracle and the group dba. They happen to be the default. However, in order to use different user names, you must re-link the Oracle S/W since the group is bound in to the oracle kernel at link time (trivial procedure). However, if multiple users are sharing the Oracle executables, then they must share the same unix group id (since it is linked into the code). Typically, I find that it is best to create a single oracle account (or a small number of oracle accounts for related instances), and use a shell script to display a choice of various Oracle instance names to the user. Then depending on the response, the ORACLE_HOME, ORACLE_SID and other variables are set. Then when the user logs in, all the environment variables are set correctly, and the ORACLE_HOME directory is different than the oracle account's home directory. And, if I install a new version of Oracle, it lives in it's own ORACLE_HOME directory, and each individual instance is not affected by changes made to another, I simply have to edit the script that lives in the oracle account's home directory so it sets the environment variables correctly. You should be able to create qtrees and/or volumes and mount points so that the Filer matches exactly what your DBA's see today in an existing environment, if that would make them happier. -tom > -----Original Message----- > From: George Kahler [mailto:george@YorkU.CA] > Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2001 10:05 AM > To: toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Multiple Oracle DBs on a filer > > > Hi, > I'm setting up an 840 filer for our DBA group to run about > 4-to-5 Oracle > OLT databases and 4-to-5 Oracle DSS databases being served from about > 1/2 a dozen Unix servers. This is something new to the DBAs > in that they > are not experienced with NFS or anything like a filer; a common disk > storage. Their databases are married to specific Unix servers. The > project mandates that the environment needs to be set up in such a way > that if any Unix server fails, the database service that it was > providing could easily be brought up on any other available Unix > server. (So far no problem) > > I have created and mapped out a quota tree into which I installed the > Oracle distribution. It looks something like: > /softwr/oracle/product/7.3.4 > /7.3.5 > this is then exported to all of the Unix servers. > > The problem I have with is the Unix Oracle home directory that I also > created in /softwr/oracle/home, ie. > oracle:x:600:211:Oracle user:/softwr/oracle/home:/bin/ksh > but the DBAs are telling me that the oracle home directory > needs to be unique > for each Unix server and Database running on that server because the > home directory is the place where they keep their environment. > > How do other people deal with this? Do you create specific Unix > accounts for each Oracle database running on a server? > > Thanks > George > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ----------------- > George Kahler e-mail: > george(a)yorku.ca > Sr. Systems Administrator humans: (416) > 736-2100 x.22699 > Computing and Network Services machines: (416) 736-5830 > Ontario, Canada, M3J-1P3 >

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