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13531 discussions

RE: Repost: wafl scan question
by jwitham＠takedapharm.com 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

In our case, it's an exploding M$ Exchange Information store... It started out on 2 36G disks, now it's up to 4. Mailbox quotas must be nice... I was turned on to the wafl commands by one of our local PSE's last week, we were having horrible performance reported while our Exchange snapshot verifications were running. A statit showed 1 disk at 100% activity, and the next one at 66%. I ran a 'wafl scan measure_layout', and got: wafl_filesystem_sca:info]: WAFL layout ratio for volume vol7 is 4.87. (A ratio of 1 is optimal). So, I run a 'wafl scan reallocate vol7', let it chug for an hour, then run another 'wafl scan measure_layout', and it's still 4.87 :( I've done this twice now, with no change in waffling. We're running 6.1.2. At the advice of my PSE, I'm opening a ticket with NOW. John Witham Sr. Data Networking Engineer Takeda Pharmaceuticals North America, Inc. e://jwitham@takedapharm.com V://847.383.3304 F://847.383.3205 A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history, with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila. -Mitch Ratcliffe -----Original Message----- From: barry(a)lustig.com [mailto:barry@lustig.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 12:15 PM To: Matt Musgrove Cc: Jeff Kennedy; NDMP List Subject: Re: Repost: wafl scan question This sounds like it would be useful for volumes that started out with low performance needs with a small number of disks in the array that ended up with large raid sizes. I imagine that files would get striped across the larger number of drives after the reallocate. barry On Wednesday, January 23, 2002, at 02:00 AM, Matt Musgrove wrote: >> From my ONTAP course notes: > > wafl scan reallocate takes a volume or file and reallocates it on the > disk to > increase its layout efficiency (ie. defrags). However, you should only > run > this command on the advice of NetApp. It should only be run if volume > capacity is <80% and during a non-peak period (filer impact similar to > a vol > copy command). > > hope that helps > > Matt Musgrove > > Jeff Kennedy wrote: > >> Don't know if this didn't get through or what so I'm reposting. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Jeff Kennedy wrote: >>> >>> What exactly does 'wafl scan reallocate' do? Does it actually >>> re-write >>> data in a more efficient manner/layout? Or does it redo inodes and >>> pointers in a more efficient layout without moving data? >>> >>> I know that a reallocate is unnecessary if the measure_layout is low >>> (most of mine are under 2) but on occassion I get higher numbers and >>> wonder what it does to fix this. >>> >>> Thanks. >> -- >> ===================== >> Jeff Kennedy >> Unix Administrator >> AMCC >> jlkennedy(a)amcc.com > This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged or confidential information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited.

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wafl scan question
by Jeff Kennedy 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

What exactly does 'wafl scan reallocate' do? Does it actually re-write data in a more efficient manner/layout? Or does it redo inodes and pointers in a more efficient layout without moving data? I know that a reallocate is unnecessary if the measure_layout is low (most of mine are under 2) but on occassion I get higher numbers and wonder what it does to fix this. Thanks. -- ===================== Jeff Kennedy Unix Administrator AMCC jlkennedy(a)amcc.com

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RE: Veritas Netbackup mailing list
by Melvin, Grant 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Hi Jan, Check out: Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu(a)mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu Cheers, Grant For information on NetApp's Data Protection Solutions view http://www.netapp.com/solutions/data_protection.html. -----Original Message----- From: Schepers, Jan [mailto:Jan.Schepers@atosorigin.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 2:15 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Veritas Netbackup mailing list Hello list, is there a Veritas Netbackup mailing list as there is a Legato Networker list on http://listmail.temple.edu/archives/networker.html regards, Jan

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F230 6.1.1R2 upgrade ?
by Frank Bonnet 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Hi We have a F230 running Ontap 5.3.2 Should I safely upgrade it to 6.1.1R2 ? Thanks -- Frank Bonnet

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Refurbish Filers
by Ali Maula Ali Mauli Ali DamDam 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Hi guyz, I'm just wondering,is there any way to get refurbished filers.Becoz,we thinking of purchasing old filers e.g. f720,f740 for our own internal trainings. thx, rgds, tiger ===== "Forgiveness is the fragrance that the flower leaves on the heel of the one that crushed it."--->Ali Maula Ali Mauli Ali DamDam __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/

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RE: Veritas Netbackup mailing list
by Traitel, Eyal 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Enjoy those: <http://www.backupcentral.com/faqs.html> Eyal. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Eyal Traitel CNA, MCSE, Solaris CA, Legato CA, SNIA FC SAN L2 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- eTraitel - I'm the new eBuzzword around !!! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Get answers NOW! - NetApp On the Web - http://now.netapp.com -----Original Message----- From: Schepers, Jan [mailto:Jan.Schepers@atosorigin.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 11:15 To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Veritas Netbackup mailing list Hello list, is there a Veritas Netbackup mailing list as there is a Legato Networker list on http://listmail.temple.edu/archives/networker.html regards, Jan

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Veritas Netbackup mailing list
by Schepers, Jan 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Hello list, is there a Veritas Netbackup mailing list as there is a Legato Networker list on http://listmail.temple.edu/archives/networker.html regards, Jan

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2001 Excess IT Inventory at prices below Wholesale!
by sr＠r2rcentral.com 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

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RE: ascii files convertion UNIX <--> windows ?
by Stout, Noelette 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

On the UNIX side, you can also use the dos2unix and unix2dos commands. I have also found Sun's StarOffice to be very useful for manipulating UNIX text files on Windows systems and vice versa. Noelette Stout Unix System Administrator IKON Office Solutions, Inc Digital Express tel. (770)326-4140 fax (770)326-4139 email: nstout(a)ikon.com -----Original Message----- From: Steve Losen [mailto:scl@sasha.acc.virginia.edu] Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 8:28 AM To: Frank Bonnet Cc: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: ascii files convertion UNIX <--> windows ? > Hi > > After success in accessing UNIX homedir from windows > ( thanks to all that respond ) I am facing a problem > with ascii file conversion > > An ascii file created under UNIX cannot be viewded > correctly under windows ( CR LF conversion ) is there an > option with Ontap to convert ascii files when opening > them under windows and vice-versa ? > > Thanks a lot. The filer does not do any data conversion that I am aware of. In our experience we have found that folks who use both Windows and Unix do not often manipulate the same file on both systems. Usually Windows files are only manipulated from Windows and Unix files only from Unix. However, we do recommend installing NoteTab Light on Windows and using that instead of standard Windows NotePad. NoteTab accepts all three text file line terminators: LF (unix) CRLF (dos) CR (Apple) and will generate output using any of these. So you can keep a file in its original format or convert it. http://www.notetab.com On the Unix side, Solaris has the "flip" command that converts a text file from LF to CRLF and vice versa. This utility may be available on other flavors of Unix, too. If you don't have flip, here is a trivial awk command to convert unix to dos by adding CR to each line: awk '{print $0 "\r"}' unixfile > dosfile Here is a trivial sed command to convert dos to unix by stripping the CR at the end of the line. sed 's/.$//' dosfile > unixfile On Linux, vi (vim) detects the line terminator style and preserves it. And you can also force dos line terminators with the vi command :set fileformat=dos or :set ff=dos To force unix use :set fileformat=unix or :set ff=unix Steve Losen scl(a)virginia.edu phone: 434-924-0640 University of Virginia ITC Unix Support

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FW: Gigabit ethernet performance
by Hudson, Jim 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Taking Sun/Solaris out of the equasion: My snapmirror between a F760 and F840 with gigabit interfaces is running at about 300Mb/s with MTU size 9000 and flowcontrol set to none. Without jumbo frames I was seeing throughput of about 200Mb/s. James S. Hudson UNIX Systems Administrator Pfizer Global Research and Development, La Jolla Laboratories 11095 Torreyana Road San Diego CA 92121 858.622.7665 -----Original Message----- From: Hsueh-Mei Tsai(May Tsai) [mailto:may-tsai@ti.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2002 11:38 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: Gigabit ethernet performance Thanks for all the replies. Some background info: Sun client is a 420R running Solaris7, NetApp is F820 running 6.1.1R2. Both are PCI cards. I've checked the NOW sites and tried to change various Sun parameters with no significant differences. Local disk creation takes 35 secs(single drive) vs. NetApp's 7 data/1 parity volume, which produces ~30secs results. Direct tmpfs writes takes 8 secs. Aggregated results in 27.5 seconds, still not much better though. The NetApp support engineer I worked with mentioned it's back-to-back CP bottleneck, that's not on the network side, correct? Does that mean the Netapp F820 can't handle consistent huge data flows? As to Jumbo frame, I haven't tried it yet, the Gbit switch I use probably won't support it, well. Does it adds a lot to the performance? May

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RE: Gigabit ethernet performance
by Link, Bill (OTS-EDH) 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

That's about what I see on an unloaded gbit interface from an ibm s7a to an 840, but it is still nearly twice as fast as the local ssa disks. Bill -----Original Message----- From: Hsueh-Mei Tsai(May Tsai) [mailto:may-tsai@ti.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2002 9:43 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Gigabit ethernet performance Does anybody knows what kind of performance I can expect from using the Gigabit ethernet on Solaris/NetApp? For example, if mkfile 1024m 1gbfile on a NFS mounted netapp volume thru the gbit interface, how many seconds of response time is considered to be reasonable? I'm getting about 30secs, while I'm hoping within 12secs, am I dreaming? Thanks, -May -- Notice: This e-mail and any attachments are intended only for the individual or company to which it is addressed and may contain information which is privileged, confidential and prohibited from disclosure or unauthorized use under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, or copying of this e-mail or the information contained in this e-mail is strictly prohibited by the sender. If you have received this transmission in error, please return the material received to the sender and delete all copies from your system. Thank you.

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Re: Gigabit ethernet performance
by MCope＠isisph.com 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Check out the NOW site for information on improving the performance of Sun GigE cards. Are you NICs SBUS or PCI cards? My SBUS systems have less than stellar performance using SUN cards. All of my PCI bus systems use a third party card (Alteon) which is definately faster but being from a different vendor makes it hard to do a fair comparison.

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Changing file ownership in NT
by Gifford, Josh 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Hello everyone, Here's the story: Months ago I moved all my user directories to our filer. I wrote (or borrowed) a neat little script to change the permissions in each user directory using the cacls command. Of course, the files are still owned by the administrators group of the filer. The question of user quotas is now coming up and I know that at some point I'm going to need to change the ownership of each user directory so that I can enable these quotas. Is there a command line utility for changing the ownership of files (similar to chown in UNIX)? Best Regards, Josh J Gifford MCP NT Systems Engineer Siemens Power Transmission & Distribution 7000 Siemens Rd Wendell, NC 27591 Phone: (919) 365-2806; Fax: (919) 365-1080

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Summary: Overland Data LXS jukebox and NetApp
by Darragh, Stephen J 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

I had a problem getting the LXS7115 library recognized by the filer. I had to go into the jukebox and set the defaults to COMPAQ instead of overland I then set the library id back to 6, and set it to scsi-2 instead of scsi3 (don't know if that was required). This fixed the problem. If I have to go back, I must use the front panel display to manually tell the jukebox that its not a compaq. Stephen Darragh

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Re: Netapp alternatives
by ScottUCE＠aol.com 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Hello, Art: NetApp's standard Software License Agreement permanently ties their software to both 1) the machine's serial number and 2) the end user. Thus, if the machine is ever sold, the new end user must purchase new software licenses from NetApp (very expensive!). However, some companies -- prior to purchase -- have negotiated agreements with NetApp that allow them to freely transfer the software user licenses on their purchased machines to a new end user. When Union Computer receives a purchase order for one of these used machines, we arrange for the original owner of the system to provide Network Appliance with information on the new end user: 1) company name and address, 2) where the machine is to be located, and 3) contact names and phone numbers. Network Appliance then processes the license transfers, free of charge. Our buyers usually confirm the transfer of the licenses with Network Appliance before we even ship the machine. We advise all buyers of new NetApp machines -- or any other computer hardware and software, for that matter -- to insist on transferable software licenses for the protection of their investments. All of us --- dealers, users and the manufacturer --- benefit greatly from an active secondary market. Regards, Scott Fischmann Union Computer Exchange, Inc. 6233 Idylwood Lane Minneapolis, MN 55436 Phone: 952 935 7282 FAX: 952 935 5056 scott(a)unioncomputer.com ************************************ In a message dated 1/21/2002 5:38:20 PM Central Standard Time, art(a)arzoon.com writes: > Scott -- please explain how some are transferable and some aren't? Do you > set this up before you buy the gear? Is it additional money? > > thanks > > art > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ScottUCE(a)aol.com [mailto:ScottUCE@aol.com] >> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 10:05 AM >> To: SRoche(a)datalink.com; joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com; pdg(a)uow.edu.au; >> toasters(a)mathworks.com >> Subject: Re: Netapp alternatives >> >> >> There ARE used NetApp systems with "used software" that CAN be re-sold, >> and NetApp itself will process the license transfer, free of charge, to >> the new owner. We have sold many of them ourselves, and NetApp has always >> cooperated fully. >> >> Yes, it is true that many NetApp systems do not have transferable licenses >> -- but many do. >> >> Scott Fischmann >> Union Computer Exchange, Inc. >> 6233 Idylwood Lane >> Minneapolis, MN 55436 >> Phone: 952 935 7282 >> FAX: 952 935 5056 >> scott(a)unioncomputer.com >> >> *************************************************** >> >> In a message dated 1/21/2002 11:14:30 AM Central Standard Time, >> SRoche(a)datalink.com writes: >> >> >> >>> This was taken off of Netapps web page regarding transferring licences. >>> I think it speaks for itself as far a Netapps legal position. >>> >>> All Network Appliance software license terms and conditions specify a >>> "license to use," therefore software cannot legally transfer from one >>> owner to another. Anyone purchasing used hardware equipment must also >>> purchase new software licenses directly either from Network Appliance or >>> from an authorized Network Appliance reseller. Software includes all >>> protocols as well as streaming licenses, Snap products, and other >>> software. Anyone trying to sell you "used software" would be violating >>> the terms of the license. Support contracts such as warranty and >>> maintenance agreements are also non-transferable. >>> >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: ScottUCE(a)aol.com [mailto:ScottUCE@aol.com] >>>> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 10:09 AM >>>> To: joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com; pdg(a)uow.edu.au; >>>> toasters(a)mathworks.com >>>> Subject: Re: Netapp alternatives >>>> >>>> >>>> In a message dated 1/18/2002 4:06:48 PM Central Standard Time, >>>> joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com writes: >>>> >>>> >>>> but if you're just looking >>>> to save a few $, then I would suggest considering stepping down to an >>>> F810 >>>> or even F87 before ruling out NetApp on price (I may be reading too much >>>> into your post here). >>>> >>> >>> Hello, Joe: >>> >>> You don't necessarily have to "step down" to an F810 or F87 -- let alone >>> abandon NetApp altogether for Sun or Procom or Compaq -- to save money. >>> >>> There are great buys on a limited number of used NetApp filers available >>> today -- F720s, F740s and F760s with transferable NFS, CIFS and even >>> CLUSTER licenses. As such, I don't believe there is any reason a NAS >>> user has to settle for a "non-NetApp" solution because of price. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Scott >>> >>> Scott Fischmann >>> Union Computer Exchange, Inc. >>> 6233 Idylwood Lane >>> Minneapolis, MN 55436 >>> Phone: 952 935 7282 >>> FAX: 952 935 5056 >>> scott(a)unioncomputer.com >> >

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Virus Alert
by postmaster＠mathworks.com 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

The MathWorks' scanner detected a virus called "PE_NIMDA.E" from lois(a)deas.harvard.edu in your mail traffic on 01/21/2002 21:45:34. We quarantined it.

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(sampledesktopsct9fdesktopsamplesct9fsct9fsampledesktopsct9csct9csct9csct9fdesktopsct9fsamplesct9csct9csct9fsct9csct9fsct9fsct9csamplesct9fsct9cdesktopsct9fsct9fsamplesct9fsct9csamplesamplesct9csamplesamplesampledesktopsamplesamplesamplesamplesct9csct9cssmtp.mathworks.com.sample
by lois＠deas.harvard.edu 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

------------------ Virus Warning Message (on scanner) Found virus PE_NIMDA.E in file sample.exe The uncleanable file sample.exe is moved to /etc/iscan/virus/virGLCKFaWnJ. --------------------------------------------------------- ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on scanner) sample.exe is removed from here because it contains a virus. ---------------------------------------------------------

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RE: Performance Issues
by Art Hebert 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Make sure your cards are on the 64bit bus not the 32bit bus. We moved our 100mb cards from the Netapp certified slots and doubled performance. art -----Original Message----- From: Noll, Kevin [mailto:kevin.noll@cgey.com] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 4:20 PM To: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: RE: Performance Issues I have the same problem. I have also tried ndmpcopy, and have found performance has increased, however not substantial enough to jump up and down for joy. We have added Gig patches to our solaris 2.6 installation. (Presumably ins olaris 2.8 the patches would be included. Flow control is set to full, No CRC errors. Full Duplex enabled. Gig Network running NFS Version3 with UDP and I could get better performance with Sun to Sun or /tmp to Netapp. Our Netapps are in cluster and combinations of large file transfer between volume to volume on the same Netapp or even volume to volume between Netapps in cluster gives poor performance. CPU utalisation is not over 20%. Our Gig cards are Version 3. Thanks Kevin -----Original Message----- From: Mike Carroll [mailto:mcarroll@chiaro.com] Sent: 21 January 2002 22:11 To: 'Rick Gardner'; 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: RE: Performance Issues If you use ndmpcopy provided from the now site, it will not copy your files across the network. basically like: ndmpcopy <filer_name>:/vol/vol0/test <filer_name>:/vol/shares/test Would copy from one volume to another without the network. The command also works copying between filers if you have more than one, that's why the hostname before the filenames. Search for ndmpcopy at the NOW site, it will help more!! Mike Carroll -----Original Message----- From: Rick Gardner [mailto:rgardner@westernelectronics.com] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 12:39 PM To: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: Performance Issues Anyone seen this problem? I have performance problems when I copy large amounts of data between directories within the same volume on the NetApp. It is about 10 times faster to copy it back to my Sun box /tmp and then back to the filer.. I have a Cluster 820 with Gig NICs and the Sun box is a SunFire 280R, Solaris 8, with Gig NICs. No options with the mount commands. No CRC errors on the switch, NetApps, or Suns... Any ideas? Thanks! **************************************************************************** **************** " This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Cap Gemini Ernst & Young Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message ". **************************************************************************** ****************

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Are snapshots still available only per volume?
by Art Hebert 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

I have the need to snapshot just some directories and not the entire volume, have they made any progress in this area? Art Hebert Email: art(a)arzoon.com <mailto:art@arzoon.com> Arzoon IT Dept. Phone: 650 995-6125 Mobile: 650 444-8667

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RE: Performance Issues
by Noll, Kevin 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

I have the same problem. I have also tried ndmpcopy, and have found performance has increased, however not substantial enough to jump up and down for joy. We have added Gig patches to our solaris 2.6 installation. (Presumably in solaris 2.8 the patches would be included. Flow control is set to full, No CRC errors. Full Duplex enabled. Gig Network running NFS Version3 with UDP and I could get better performance with Sun to Sun or /tmp to Netapp. Our Netapps are in cluster and combinations of large file transfer between volume to volume on the same Netapp or even volume to volume between Netapps in cluster gives poor performance. CPU utalisation is not over 20%. Our Gig cards are Version 3. Thanks Kevin -----Original Message----- From: Mike Carroll [mailto:mcarroll@chiaro.com] Sent: 21 January 2002 22:11 To: 'Rick Gardner'; 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: RE: Performance Issues If you use ndmpcopy provided from the now site, it will not copy your files across the network. basically like: ndmpcopy <filer_name>:/vol/vol0/test <filer_name>:/vol/shares/test Would copy from one volume to another without the network. The command also works copying between filers if you have more than one, that's why the hostname before the filenames. Search for ndmpcopy at the NOW site, it will help more!! Mike Carroll -----Original Message----- From: Rick Gardner [mailto:rgardner@westernelectronics.com] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 12:39 PM To: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: Performance Issues Anyone seen this problem? I have performance problems when I copy large amounts of data between directories within the same volume on the NetApp. It is about 10 times faster to copy it back to my Sun box /tmp and then back to the filer.. I have a Cluster 820 with Gig NICs and the Sun box is a SunFire 280R, Solaris 8, with Gig NICs. No options with the mount commands. No CRC errors on the switch, NetApps, or Suns... Any ideas? Thanks! ******************************************************************************************** " This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Cap Gemini Ernst & Young Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message ". ********************************************************************************************

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RE: Netapp alternatives
by Art Hebert 21 Jan '02

21 Jan '02

Scott -- please explain how some are transferable and some aren't? Do you set this up before you buy the gear? Is it additional money? thanks art -----Original Message----- From: ScottUCE(a)aol.com [mailto:ScottUCE@aol.com] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 10:05 AM To: SRoche(a)datalink.com; joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com; pdg(a)uow.edu.au; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: Netapp alternatives There ARE used NetApp systems with "used software" that CAN be re-sold, and NetApp itself will process the license transfer, free of charge, to the new owner. We have sold many of them ourselves, and NetApp has always cooperated fully. Yes, it is true that many NetApp systems do not have transferable licenses -- but many do. Scott Fischmann Union Computer Exchange, Inc. 6233 Idylwood Lane Minneapolis, MN 55436 Phone: 952 935 7282 FAX: 952 935 5056 scott(a)unioncomputer.com *************************************************** In a message dated 1/21/2002 11:14:30 AM Central Standard Time, SRoche(a)datalink.com writes: This was taken off of Netapps web page regarding transferring licences. I think it speaks for itself as far a Netapps legal position. All Network Appliance software license terms and conditions specify a "license to use," therefore software cannot legally transfer from one owner to another. Anyone purchasing used hardware equipment must also purchase new software licenses directly either from Network Appliance or from an authorized Network Appliance reseller. Software includes all protocols as well as streaming licenses, Snap products, and other software. Anyone trying to sell you "used software" would be violating the terms of the license. Support contracts such as warranty and maintenance agreements are also non-transferable. -----Original Message----- From: ScottUCE(a)aol.com [mailto:ScottUCE@aol.com] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 10:09 AM To: joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com; pdg(a)uow.edu.au; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Re: Netapp alternatives In a message dated 1/18/2002 4:06:48 PM Central Standard Time, joe.luchtenberg(a)data-line.com writes: but if you're just looking to save a few $, then I would suggest considering stepping down to an F810 or even F87 before ruling out NetApp on price (I may be reading too much into your post here). Hello, Joe: You don't necessarily have to "step down" to an F810 or F87 -- let alone abandon NetApp altogether for Sun or Procom or Compaq -- to save money. There are great buys on a limited number of used NetApp filers available today -- F720s, F740s and F760s with transferable NFS, CIFS and even CLUSTER licenses. As such, I don't believe there is any reason a NAS user has to settle for a "non-NetApp" solution because of price. Regards, Scott Scott Fischmann Union Computer Exchange, Inc. 6233 Idylwood Lane Minneapolis, MN 55436 Phone: 952 935 7282 FAX: 952 935 5056 scott(a)unioncomputer.com

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Re: Netapp alternatives
by Peter D. Gray 21 Jan '02

21 Jan '02

Wow, this seems like an emotive issue. Just to make my position clear: 1) I like netapps (we have 2 filers and 3 caches). 2) I would not even be looking at other brands if the netapp solutions was not so expensive. Note 1: it is not just a few dollars, it is over double the price for the same storage and performance or the same price using older filers (F740's) at 1/4 the performance. This is significant money. Oh, and the procom solution is upgradable just by swapping the drives. The netapp solution REQUIRES a new head and of course that means new (expensive) software licenses. Note 2: some things about netapp p*ss me off. The software licensing scheme, the small number of configurations that they support etc. I know there are reasons for all these things but they still p*ss me off. Note 3: I still think the netapp solution will have the best reliability and support. But maybe I can live with a bit less reliability to save ~$150K. And thanks for all the people who replied with comments. The general consensus was that netapp is the rolls royce of filers, the veritas solution is interesting but very new and that procom is ok (although 1 person reported that they had seen problems with procom filers under load). Regards, pdg -- See mail headers for contact information.

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RE: Performance Issues
by Mike Carroll 21 Jan '02

21 Jan '02

If you use ndmpcopy provided from the now site, it will not copy your files across the network. basically like: ndmpcopy <filer_name>:/vol/vol0/test <filer_name>:/vol/shares/test Would copy from one volume to another without the network. The command also works copying between filers if you have more than one, that's why the hostname before the filenames. Search for ndmpcopy at the NOW site, it will help more!! Mike Carroll -----Original Message----- From: Rick Gardner [mailto:rgardner@westernelectronics.com] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 12:39 PM To: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: Performance Issues Anyone seen this problem? I have performance problems when I copy large amounts of data between directories within the same volume on the NetApp. It is about 10 times faster to copy it back to my Sun box /tmp and then back to the filer.. I have a Cluster 820 with Gig NICs and the Sun box is a SunFire 280R, Solaris 8, with Gig NICs. No options with the mount commands. No CRC errors on the switch, NetApps, or Suns... Any ideas? Thanks! ----------------------------------------- (on Chiaro SMTP Relay) This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are the property of Chiaro Networks, Ltd., and may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) to whom this e-mail is addressed. If you are not one of the named recipient(s), or otherwise have reason to believe that you have received this message in error, please notify the sender and delete all copies from your system. Any other use, retention, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. ---------------------------------------------------------

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RE: Performance Issues
by Rick Gardner 21 Jan '02

21 Jan '02

Sorry, I do not know what a CE card is, or how to tell if I have one. -----Original Message----- From: Jason S. Cash [mailto:cash@UDel.Edu] Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 1:26 PM To: Rick Gardner Cc: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Subject: Re: Performance Issues On Mon, 21 Jan 2002, Rick Gardner wrote: > I have performance problems when I copy large amounts of data between > directories within the same volume on the NetApp. It is about 10 times > faster to copy it back to my Sun box /tmp and then back to the filer.. I > have a Cluster 820 with Gig NICs and the Sun box is a SunFire 280R, Solaris > 8, with Gig NICs. No options with the mount commands. Are these CE (casseni (sp?) cards? Jason > > No CRC errors on the switch, NetApps, or Suns... > > Any ideas? > > Thanks! > /* Jason S. Cash - Systems Programmer IT/Network and Systems Services University of Delaware, Newark Delaware e:cash@udel.edu v: 302-831-0461 */

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Performance Issues
by Rick Gardner 21 Jan '02

21 Jan '02

Anyone seen this problem? I have performance problems when I copy large amounts of data between directories within the same volume on the NetApp. It is about 10 times faster to copy it back to my Sun box /tmp and then back to the filer.. I have a Cluster 820 with Gig NICs and the Sun box is a SunFire 280R, Solaris 8, with Gig NICs. No options with the mount commands. No CRC errors on the switch, NetApps, or Suns... Any ideas? Thanks!

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