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13531 discussions

Enlarge a volume owned by a vfiler
by toaster＠chopel.de 15 Jun '04

15 Jun '04

Hi, I have a problem to enlarge a volume owned by a "dr"-vfiler. Vfiler1 Vfiler1 (dr backup) |--> vol1 |-->vol1 It was possible to add a disk to vol1 on both sites. But I can't disable the volume option "fixed fs_size", because vol1 is in "snapmirrored-state". How can I enlarge the volume without deleting the dr-filer? Thanks for help, Michael

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RE: Enlarge a volume owned by a vfiler
by Uehara, Tsuneyuki (Gen) 15 Jun '04

15 Jun '04

We perform "snapmirror quiesce" then "snapmirror break" then turn off "fs_size_fixed". # Gen Uehara -----Original Message----- From: owner-toasters(a)mathworks.com [mailto:owner-toasters@mathworks.com] On Behalf Of toaster(a)chopel.de Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2004 10:12 PM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Enlarge a volume owned by a vfiler Hi, I have a problem to enlarge a volume owned by a "dr"-vfiler. Vfiler1 Vfiler1 (dr backup) |--> vol1 |-->vol1 It was possible to add a disk to vol1 on both sites. But I can't disable the volume option "fixed fs_size", because vol1 is in "snapmirrored-state". How can I enlarge the volume without deleting the dr-filer? Thanks for help, Michael

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RE: Best practices for new RAID group
by Moshe Linzer 15 Jun '04

15 Jun '04

I agree with Tom. Your best bet is to add 6 disks to a new raid group. No sense in having all those spares sitting around doing nothing. I would try to avoid expanding a 36GB-disk raid group past 14 disks for reliability. Moshe Linzer IT Manager National Semiconductor, Israel Phone: 972-9-970-2247 Fax: 972-9-970-2001 "Yarmas, Tom" <Tom.Yarmas(a)netapp.com> Sent by: owner-toasters(a)mathworks.com 04/06/2004 04:19 To: "Stewart, John" <johns(a)artesyncp.com>, toasters(a)mathworks.com cc: "IT Technical Services" <ITTech(a)artesyncp.com> Subject: RE: Best practices for new RAID group The paper you reference is a little dated unless you are still running 5.x of Data ONTAP. Data ONTAP version 6.x included some significant changes to the WAFL and ONTAP RAID. The number of RAID groups is much less relevant than the total number of data drives in the volume. However, adding 1 or two drives to a volume (or RAID Group) is still not the best approach. Your best bet is to add a new RAID group of 6 disks to the volume. You will be adding the disks anyway (over time), and you are using qtrees to divvy up the space, so just add them all at one time and not worry about it. As Chris Thompson pointed out you can use RAID-DP (assuming you are running DOT 6.5), and add 2 disks to the existing RAID group. But that would likely not be optimal because you would still have a small number of "empty" disks in the RAID group and they will be utilized more than the other "more full" disks until space gets more evenly distributed across all of the drives. -tom -----Original Message----- From: Stewart, John [mailto:johns@artesyncp.com] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 5:44 PM To: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Cc: IT Technical Services Subject: Best practices for new RAID group We've got an F740 with three shelves of 36GB disks (the 3rd recently added). We've only got one volume, vol0, with 14 disks in it now (13 data and one parity). We use both CIFS and NFS. We have 7 spare disks (6 of which we'd like to eventually use for data, with one spare of course). I just went to add one of the spare disks to vol0 (running low on space) and got the error: vol add: starting a new RAID group; at least two disks are needed So, as I (now) understand it, we've got to either: - Override the 14 disk limit for a RAID group or - Add a new RAID group to the current volume or - Add a new volume The 3rd choice is unattractive because we like the idea of One Huge Filesystem, that we can divvy up as needed into different qtrees. The 2nd choice sounds like a Bad Idea in that according to this document, section 3.4: http://www.netapp.com/tech_library/3027.html, that the filer will try to distribute writes evenly between the old and new RAID group... if the new RAID group only contains two disks (we don't want to add more disk space than is needed now), this could be disatrous to performance So is the 1st choice, increasing the size of the RAID group, a viable option? What is the downsize? Only increased risk of a double disk failure taking out the whole system? Is it possible to add a second parity disk to the same RAID group? Am I missing something here? Any clue-by-fours quite welcome. thanks johnS

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RE: Hirearchical Storage Management - Solid state & Hard disk(NAS/SAN)
by Reinoud Reynders 15 Jun '04

15 Jun '04

Hi Maren, We use here MS Exchange with I-SCSI connection to our filers (fast FC-disks). Because we want a small and flexible DB, we use archiving software from KVS. With this software, we archive all our 'old' mails to a cheaper and little slower NearStore (R150 from NetApp with ATA-disk). This is transparent for our users. This work great and the users can use their email box as a real archive without quota troubles. Best Regards, Reinoud UZLeuven Belgium -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Maren S. Leizaola [mailto:leizaola@hk.com] Verzonden: maandag 14 juni 2004 23:25 Aan: toasters(a)mathworks.com Onderwerp: Hirearchical Storage Management - Solid state & Hard disk(NAS/SAN) Hi, In a lot of the system I can think off a small portion of the data is accessed very frequently and a large percentage of the data is very rarely accessed. An example would be typical email store. Directories of the mail store are read very frequently however once an email is read and responded to they typically are infrequently read again. Are there any systems out there that could would use Solid state disks as the active storage and then you could use something like a NAS or SAN to use as the "slow archive storage". This would permit one to give a much higher performance with and serve more users and have cheaper and slower NAS/SAN backing the system. Pardon my ignorance if what I am asking is common place out there but I've not seen this. Does what I am suggesting make sense? Regards, Maren. -------------------------------------------------------------- HKdotCOM Ltd AIM: MarenHKdotCOM Tel: 852 2865-4865 ext 888 leizaola(a)hk.com ICQ: 39905706 Fax: 852 2865-4100 -------------------------------------------------------------- Join our liquidations list : http://www.lists.hk.com/lists/listinfo/liquidations

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RE: oracle 9i cluster using iScsi?
by Michael Christian 15 Jun '04

15 Jun '04

Hi Adi, We're running a few 9i RAC clusters. Not a lot in production yet, but we've been stressing and tuning it for over a year. Typically 4 nodes per cluster, using a combination of OCFS/iSCSI and NFS. Datafiles go onto OCFS/iSCSI and archive logs go onto NFS (because OCFS sucks at small files). We're using Redhat 2.4.9-e.38enterprise. We've been working directly with Netapp and Oracle development, pulling them tooth and nail along the cert process, and I believe it just got completed, so we're probably the first in production. Contact Oracle for more info. We even have a bi-coastal set of clusters, with multiple masters running streams replication; as far as I know we're the first at that too. It's difficult to implement, I wouldn't recommend it. Note that we are using the Adaptec 7211C TOEs, not the Cisco drivers. Oh, and by the way, it works great, and many of our NFS DBA's are drooling over iSCSI at this point. It's much faster than NFS, and much cheaper than FCP, and when 10gig comes out, it will be much faster *and* cheaper than either. There are some Adaptec tuning parameters I can share if people are using the 7211C's. It helps to raise the inflight cap. Also, there are some hacks you can do to force linux to mount multiple luns. By default it only scans the first lun per target (because of a problem with CD stackers trying to scan every cd at boot). The Adaptec instructions tell you how to rebuild the kernel, which, of course, defeats your Oracle support. There is a better way... The downside is that you don't get the great features that have been baked into Netapp's NAS software for so long. Remember that iSCSI is SAN, and Netapp rocks at NAS, but are new at SAN. Snapshots take up a lot of space, a full lun size per snap or +1 lun + 20%,depending on who you talk to. Also, the nice .snapshot directory isn't there. You can implement that with cron jobs quiescing the db, deleting/creating/renaming/remounting snapped luns, but it's messy. Bottom line is that if you're considering a move from NFS, the performance will blow you away, but the maintenance might be a pain in the arse. -Mike Christian -----Original Message----- From: owner-toasters(a)mathworks.com [mailto:owner-toasters@mathworks.com] On Behalf Of Aditya Sent: Friday, June 11, 2004 10:44 AM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: oracle 9i cluster using iScsi? Anyone have experience(s) running an Oracle 9i cluster with data stored via iScsi? on a netapp? with Solaris or RedHat? We already run iScsi for other things and have no experience (or interest) in DAFS just for Oracle. We're trying to replace Sun 3310 RAID arrays with network-attached storage... Thanks, Adi

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Piecing together a NetApp on the cheap (with IDE) ?
by Joe Schmoe 15 Jun '04

15 Jun '04

I want to put together a very cheap, yet very high capacity NAS. Some of the advanced features of NetApps (like data replication over WAN, etc.) have really caught my eye, but the prices are just too much for my budget. I plan on leveraging the low cost of IDE storage. I have noticed the existence of third party disk shelves/JBODs that accept IDE disks in the front, but present a SCSI interface out the back. So my question is, would it be reasonable for me to buy a very cheap, old NetApp head unit off of ebay (like an F740 for $400) and then attach several of these SCSI enclosures packed with IDE disks to it ? Pesumably, four loaded enclosures at 4TB each (10 400gig IDEs) would give me 16TB, which is very attractive ... Let's set aside the philosophy issue of sourcing third party parts and the advice netapp has regarding that - I am simply interested if this idea is _workable_. The reason I am not looking at the native IDE NetApp units is that they are too new and are not available on ebay for hundreds of dollars. Also, I have no idea if this is even acceptable to NetApp in terms of licensing - do they support ebay purchased gear in any capacity ? Your comments and suggestions, even if tangiental, are greatly appreciated. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger

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Hirearchical Storage Management - Solid state & Hard disk(NAS/SAN)
by Maren S. Leizaola 14 Jun '04

14 Jun '04

Hi, In a lot of the system I can think off a small portion of the data is accessed very frequently and a large percentage of the data is very rarely accessed. An example would be typical email store. Directories of the mail store are read very frequently however once an email is read and responded to they typically are infrequently read again. Are there any systems out there that could would use Solid state disks as the active storage and then you could use something like a NAS or SAN to use as the "slow archive storage". This would permit one to give a much higher performance with and serve more users and have cheaper and slower NAS/SAN backing the system. Pardon my ignorance if what I am asking is common place out there but I've not seen this. Does what I am suggesting make sense? Regards, Maren. -------------------------------------------------------------- HKdotCOM Ltd AIM: MarenHKdotCOM Tel: 852 2865-4865 ext 888 leizaola(a)hk.com ICQ: 39905706 Fax: 852 2865-4100 -------------------------------------------------------------- Join our liquidations list : http://www.lists.hk.com/lists/listinfo/liquidations

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RE: Piecing together a netapp on the cheap - PART II
by Mike Sphar 14 Jun '04

14 Jun '04

Fwiw, what we've done at my company for some of those sets of data that just aren't *worthy* of being put on a Netapp, is we've also picked up some SNAP servers. They're basically a cheaper lower-end version of Netapps. (A *lot* cheaper, unfortunately, as now I often have to defend why we need to upgrade the netapp rather than "just buy a few more SNAP servers".) They don't seem to scale nearly as well as the netapps in terms of performance when there are many concurrent users, but for lower-end storage we've been fairly successful with them so far. http://www.snapappliance.com/ <http://www.snapappliance.com/> I think there are several of these low-end appliance solutions on the market now. Snap is just the one we've had experience with here. -- Mike Sphar - Sr Systems Administrator - Remedy, a BMC Software Company

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Piecing together a netapp on the cheap - PART II
by Joe Schmoe 14 Jun '04

14 Jun '04

Thanks for your help so far. Let me give some more details and answer some of the points you all have raised. First, I am looking for cheap and large - and am willing to sacrifice speed to get it. Second, I am very intrigued by SnapMirror (replication over WAN) and SnapShot copies (point in time backups). The reason I don't just build my own little unix fileservers with linux or FreeBSD is that I don't see how GNU tools and scripting can replicate the functionality of snapmirror and snapshot copies. Maybe I'm wrong ? So, I see that my initial plan is ill advised - you have pointed out that the disk shelves that NetApp ships are not just JABODs, but have intelligence in them - I did not know that the RAID striping was done in the shelf - I thought all RAID and logic was housed in the head unit and it just accessed big stacks of disks. So at this point, my questions are as follows: 1. Is there any reasonable implementation of snapmirror / snapshot copies in free UNIX OSs ? That is, can I get netapp like features out of a normal NFS fileserver ? 2. When I see netapp quote a certain capacity for its filers, like 96TB for the NearStore R200, does that simply mean that they can get to 96TB using the largest currently available IDE drives, and that once larger drives are available that number will naturally go up ? OR does it mean there is some logical limitation in place on the unit that will keep it from going above 96TB ? 3. What is the absolute cheapest IDE based NAS that netapp has put out ? Is it the NearStore R100 ? What if I bought the head unit and shelves from netapp (or netapp branded from ebay), but used my own 400gig hitachi IDE drives ? - I see a 7TB R100 on ebay right now for $78,500 - which is completely absurd. My 4TB freeBSD fileserver at home cost about $5k ... Again, many thanks. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger

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FW: Piecing together a NetApp on the cheap (with IDE) ?
by Jeff Asher 14 Jun '04

14 Jun '04

I think that the F740 only scales to 1 TB raw storage. To get to 16 TB you need to look at a newer, larger head and those aren't cheap. I believe that the FAS960 is the cheapest head that supports more than 16 TB of storage outside of clustering. The list price on a FAS960 is somewhere north of $80K. All-in-all, I probably wouldn't attempt this with a NetApp. This probably isn't workable. An F740 won't even boot if you try to use some parts that are supported in the F800 series. They are very particular about what is allowed and what will boot. I've found that if you can get the system to boot all the way, then you can probably make it work. I definitely wouldn't bet more than $0.50 on it though. You would be better off using linux, samba, and NFS. If you have to have an iSCSI target, look at www.stringbeansoftware.com <http://www.stringbeansoftware.com/> . They make iSCSI target software for Windows, but I don't know about *nix. ________________________________ From: owner-toasters(a)mathworks.com [mailto:owner-toasters@mathworks.com] On Behalf Of Joe Schmoe Sent: Friday, June 11, 2004 8:17 PM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Piecing together a NetApp on the cheap (with IDE) ? I want to put together a very cheap, yet very high capacity NAS. Some of the advanced features of NetApps (like data replication over WAN, etc.) have really caught my eye, but the prices are just too much for my budget. I plan on leveraging the low cost of IDE storage. I have noticed the existence of third party disk shelves/JBODs that accept IDE disks in the front, but present a SCSI interface out the back. So my question is, would it be reasonable for me to buy a very cheap, old NetApp head unit off of ebay (like an F740 for $400) and then attach several of these SCSI enclosures packed with IDE disks to it ? Pesumably, four loaded enclosures at 4TB each (10 400gig IDEs) would give me 16TB, which is very attractive ... Let's set aside the philosophy issue of sourcing third party parts and the advice netapp has regarding that - I am simply interested if this idea is _workable_. The reason I am not looking at the native IDE NetApp units is that they are too new and are not available on ebay for hundreds of dollars. Also, I have no idea if this is even acceptable to NetApp in terms of licensing - do they support ebay purchased gear in any capacity ? Your comments and suggestions, even if tangiental, are greatly appreciated. ________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger <http://messenger.yahoo.com/>

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14 Jun '04

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RE: Piecing together a NetApp on the cheap (with IDE) ?
by Timothy Sesow 14 Jun '04

14 Jun '04

Keep in mind that the enclosures that NetApp uses have internal intelligence that the Filer head talks to. Also, the software expects hardware to be setup in a certain manner and behave accordingly. So, the ability of certain enclosures to work with an F740 would be suspect and you would definitely need to have a DataONTAP version that supports the shelves. Most enclosures have a different interface than from other vendors. NetApp gets its enclosures from various people and they have to do a lot of software just to get them to work reliabily. Apart from the technical issues, I have looked at the prices between the "cheap" JBOD and the NetApp R200 series systems. Yes the "cheap" JBOD costs about 1/2 as much, but it takes a LOT more time to install and maintain. For most (???) sites, I think you get a false economy. For a small subset of sites, there may be the skill and labor to make it justifiable (universities come to mind, cheap or free labor from grad students and low budgets, but then NetApp probably gives them a big discount). Assuming you did get it to work, then support from NetApp would be non-standard, if at all. My best guess is that licensing would probably not be a problem, assuming you don't try to resell any of this. -----Original Message----- From: owner-toasters(a)mathworks.com on behalf of Joe Schmoe Sent: Fri 6/11/2004 6:17 PM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Piecing together a NetApp on the cheap (with IDE) ? I want to put together a very cheap, yet very high capacity NAS. Some of the advanced features of NetApps (like data replication over WAN, etc.) have really caught my eye, but the prices are just too much for my budget. I plan on leveraging the low cost of IDE storage. I have noticed the existence of third party disk shelves/JBODs that accept IDE disks in the front, but present a SCSI interface out the back. So my question is, would it be reasonable for me to buy a very cheap, old NetApp head unit off of ebay (like an F740 for $400) and then attach several of these SCSI enclosures packed with IDE disks to it ? Pesumably, four loaded enclosures at 4TB each (10 400gig IDEs) would give me 16TB, which is very attractive ... Let's set aside the philosophy issue of sourcing third party parts and the advice netapp has regarding that - I am simply interested if this idea is _workable_. The reason I am not looking at the native IDE NetApp units is that they are too new and are not available on ebay for hundreds of dollars. Also, I have no idea if this is even acceptable to NetApp in terms of licensing - do they support ebay purchased gear in any capacity ? Your comments and suggestions, even if tangiental, are greatly appreciated. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger

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14 Jun '04

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oracle 9i cluster using iScsi?
by Aditya 11 Jun '04

11 Jun '04

Anyone have experience(s) running an Oracle 9i cluster with data stored via iScsi? on a netapp? with Solaris or RedHat? We already run iScsi for other things and have no experience (or interest) in DAFS just for Oracle. We're trying to replace Sun 3310 RAID arrays with network-attached storage... Thanks, Adi

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RE: Defraging the excahgne DB
by Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM 09 Jun '04

09 Jun '04

Don't forget there are BIG differences between a FILER 'WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE' and an "ESEUTIL /d". In general it is a good rule to offline defrag your Exchange databases on a regular basis - it reclaims unused space. I don't know about others, but for me it can reclaim 10GBs of disk space. It is just a nice coincidence that performing an ESEUTIL defrag lays down a new copy of the database on the FILER and the LAYOUT ratio by definition is low. My point is that (in my opinion) just doing a WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE (provided you can get it to work) isn't enough. Eventually you need to run an ESEUTIL. - Scott W. -----Original Message----- From: Borders, Rich [mailto:Rich.Borders@netapp.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 9:28 AM To: Mark Simmons; SKIP HOFMANN Cc: avarni(a)tech.cj.com; Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Simmons [mailto:mds@gbnet.net] > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:45 AM > To: SKIP HOFMANN > Cc: 'avarni(a)tech.cj.com'; Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM; > Borders, Rich; toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Re: Defraging the excahgne DB > > Turning the question around, why would it not be safe to > defragment a file on the filer? Filer defrag requires two things ( as a general rule ): 20 percent volume space free, and no snapshots. The rest is shuffling blocks into a more application friendly pattern. > From the point of view of the client nothing should change surely? If you do offline defrags and meet the above requirements, you will effectively have an offline application and a well organized 'efficient' database afterwards. > If it did, that would be a fairly significant problem with > all files, not just Exchange's database. Technically, you can defrag a file, or the volume. The wafl scan reallocate function is trying to get the blocks closer to their layer 0 and one pointers. Defrags are really only a problem if you don't get the first two pre-req's right. > > SKIP HOFMANN wrote: > > >If you use Waffle scan then this defrags the entire vol > right? See above. > And if so is > >it safe to use on your exchange DB? Yes. > >At least on 6.3.2 -- I've noticed that WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE will > >'pause' indefinately IFF you're over your snapshot reserve. It is usually a funciton of not finding any blocks that aren't in worst fragmented shape that what you are already in. A factor of 20% free volume space with NO snapshots all but ensures this will not happen. > Otherwise > >I've run this many times with no problems. Make sure you aren't > >over your snapshot reserve and your scan should 'continue'. You should have no snapshots. > > > >On Mon, 7 Jun 2004, Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM wrote: > > > >] > >] WOW ... this is the exact opposite of what NetApp support told me. > >] > >] On a volume used for storing Exchange data, the WAFL SCAN > REALLOCATE > >command > >] will never complete. No one in NGS support should have told you it will never complete. In 6.3 and greater, it was more optimized and cleaned up, but that was a testamanet to the way block handling was done and some major efficiencies that were built into the OS of Data OnTap. > It goes for a while and then stalls. See above. > >] We monitor the layout ratios weekly and schedule down time > to perform an > >] offline DEFRAG every 4 - 6 weeks. The remarkable thing about an offline defrag is that it effectively copies the entire mailstore in application defrag back to the Filer. This means that the application is defraged as it is written. The wafl is defragged due to the nature of the blockmap and nvram/journaling. It is almost perfect. > >] This is all based on information received at the time ... > If NetApp has > >] fixed this then someone enlighten me. It is fixed, and getting better. Keep your eye open as there will be some new things to come also. I would also like to offer a thinking 'outside the box' and say that it is a cool idea to QSM the mail store from one volume to another since a QSM is a process that is going to defrag on WAFL ( not application though ) and then update on a scheduled basis. Once snapmirrored, you can stop and quiesce the application, then quiesce and break the QSM and that makes the destination read / writable. You point the exchange server to the destination, and voila, you have a reallocate and only a short downtime. > >] > >] - Scott W. That is all for now. /rich

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08 Jun '04

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08 Jun '04

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RE: Defraging the excahgne DB
by Borders, Rich 08 Jun '04

08 Jun '04

> -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Simmons [mailto:mds@gbnet.net] > Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 7:45 AM > To: SKIP HOFMANN > Cc: 'avarni(a)tech.cj.com'; Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM; > Borders, Rich; toasters(a)mathworks.com > Subject: Re: Defraging the excahgne DB > > Turning the question around, why would it not be safe to > defragment a file on the filer? Filer defrag requires two things ( as a general rule ): 20 percent volume space free, and no snapshots. The rest is shuffling blocks into a more application friendly pattern. > From the point of view of the client nothing should change surely? If you do offline defrags and meet the above requirements, you will effectively have an offline application and a well organized 'efficient' database afterwards. > If it did, that would be a fairly significant problem with > all files, not just Exchange's database. Technically, you can defrag a file, or the volume. The wafl scan reallocate function is trying to get the blocks closer to their layer 0 and one pointers. Defrags are really only a problem if you don't get the first two pre-req's right. > > SKIP HOFMANN wrote: > > >If you use Waffle scan then this defrags the entire vol > right? See above. > And if so is > >it safe to use on your exchange DB? Yes. > >At least on 6.3.2 -- I've noticed that WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE will > >'pause' indefinately IFF you're over your snapshot reserve. It is usually a funciton of not finding any blocks that aren't in worst fragmented shape that what you are already in. A factor of 20% free volume space with NO snapshots all but ensures this will not happen. > Otherwise > >I've run this many times with no problems. Make sure you aren't > >over your snapshot reserve and your scan should 'continue'. You should have no snapshots. > > > >On Mon, 7 Jun 2004, Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM wrote: > > > >] > >] WOW ... this is the exact opposite of what NetApp support told me. > >] > >] On a volume used for storing Exchange data, the WAFL SCAN > REALLOCATE > >command > >] will never complete. No one in NGS support should have told you it will never complete. In 6.3 and greater, it was more optimized and cleaned up, but that was a testamanet to the way block handling was done and some major efficiencies that were built into the OS of Data OnTap. > It goes for a while and then stalls. See above. > >] We monitor the layout ratios weekly and schedule down time > to perform an > >] offline DEFRAG every 4 - 6 weeks. The remarkable thing about an offline defrag is that it effectively copies the entire mailstore in application defrag back to the Filer. This means that the application is defraged as it is written. The wafl is defragged due to the nature of the blockmap and nvram/journaling. It is almost perfect. > >] This is all based on information received at the time ... > If NetApp has > >] fixed this then someone enlighten me. It is fixed, and getting better. Keep your eye open as there will be some new things to come also. I would also like to offer a thinking 'outside the box' and say that it is a cool idea to QSM the mail store from one volume to another since a QSM is a process that is going to defrag on WAFL ( not application though ) and then update on a scheduled basis. Once snapmirrored, you can stop and quiesce the application, then quiesce and break the QSM and that makes the destination read / writable. You point the exchange server to the destination, and voila, you have a reallocate and only a short downtime. > >] > >] - Scott W. That is all for now. /rich

1 0

RE: Defraging the excahgne DB
by SKIP HOFMANN 08 Jun '04

08 Jun '04

If you use Waffle scan then this defrags the entire vol right? And if so is it safe to use on your exchange DB? If it is then that would be greate -----Original Message----- From: avarni(a)tech.cj.com [mailto:avarni@tech.cj.com] Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 10:19 AM To: Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM Cc: SKIP HOFMANN; 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB At least on 6.3.2 -- I've noticed that WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE will 'pause' indefinately IFF you're over your snapshot reserve. Otherwise I've run this many times with no problems. Make sure you aren't over your snapshot reserve and your scan should 'continue'. On Mon, 7 Jun 2004, Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM wrote: ] ] WOW ... this is the exact opposite of what NetApp support told me. ] ] On a volume used for storing Exchange data, the WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE command ] will never complete. It goes for a while and then stalls. ] ] We monitor the layout ratios weekly and schedule down time to perform an ] offline DEFRAG every 4 - 6 weeks. ] ] This is all based on information received at the time ... If NetApp has ] fixed this then someone enlighten me. ] ] ] - Scott W. ] ] ] -----Original Message----- ] From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com] ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 2:31 PM ] To: 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com ] Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB ] ] ] Hi ] ] I just got done talking with support at Netapp, and they told me that doing ] an offline defrag of my exchange DB using the esutil will have absolutely no ] impact on the exchange DB on the filer, and they also told me that in order ] to defrag the exchange DB I must use the fillers Waffle utility to do this ] and that this would also defragment everything on the vol. They said that ] it's the responsibility of the file system on the filer to determine if a ] vol is fragmented or not, this includes all data on the vol. So knowing this ] is it safe to defrag a vol that contains an exchange DB?? ] ] Thanks again for your help it is much appreciated ] ] Skip ] ] -----Original Message----- ] From: Borders, Rich [mailto:Rich.Borders@netapp.com] ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 11:13 AM ] To: SKIP HOFMANN; toasters(a)mathworks.com ] Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB ] ] <<>> ] ] ] From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com] ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 1:33 PM ] To: toasters(a)mathworks.com ] Subject: Defraging the excahgne DB ] ] ] ] Howdy ] ] ] ] I have my exchange 5.5 DB pub and priv and my filler it's a ] FAS250 and I want to know a few things ] ] ] ] #1 can I run the eseutil utility if the DB is on my FAS 250 to ] defrag the DB? ] ] ] ] ] ] <<< This is doable as it is an offline defrag. The curious thing about ] doing this is that you are accomplishing the APPLICATION defrag, and at ] the same time getting a great by-product of a WAFL defrag. ( Essentially ] a database re-write ) >>> ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ] #2 is it the filer that determines if the exchange DB is ] fragmented or not, and if it is how would I defrag the DB? ] ] ] ] <<<The Application can fragment ( very common and accounted for by an ] online and offline defrag funciton in Exchange ) and the Filer can ] fragment. I say that tounge in cheek because the fragmentation is really ] only identified when you access the data. Since the database is one ] large file the request for data in it is atypical, the data 'fragments' ] over time. The blocks of the filer rarely match up to the blocks of the ] database, so the issues becomes when you want to get a LOT of sequential ] data from a large file ( aka mail store verify ) you will be essentially ] asking the filer to scan through it's blocks at a super high rate of ] speed.>>> ] ] ] ] ] ] #3 what happens to all other data that is stored on the same vol ] as the exchange DB once I defrag this vol? ie snap shots ] ] ] <<<The Mail store can be reallocated or the volume can. I would ] recommend the snapshots be removed as you can really get yourself into a ] pickle by 'RE'-writing a database with an application defrag, or a WAFL ] reallocate. If you are short on space, you need to get the snapshots out ] of there. Snapshots are locked images and if the file system is ] 'fragmented' then it is unlikely that you are doing much more than ] spinning your wheels if you are trying to defragment into a fragemnted ] snapshot. >>> ] ] ] ] #4 I ran a waffle scan and I got a reading of 1.8 si this ] fragmented? ] ] ] That is basically a ratio of actual file size ( df essentially ) to ] block allocation. Ex. A one terabyte volume has a 500 gig database. If ] it's layout is 1 then the File is essentially using the exact number of ] blocks that a Filer of 500 gigs needs. If the layout were 1.8 then the ] 500 gig df would still be 500 but the block allocation would actually be ] closer to the 900 gig . This is usually not an issue until the ratio ] takes the block allocation higher then the volume size. A 2.1 layout ] would mean that a 500 gig df would be 1.05 TB. This means you are ] rescanning on a request of data on the last .05 TB. If the Filer were a ] 900 gig df, then a layout of 1.8 would be MUCH more impactful. It is not ] the end of the world, you just have to manage it. You are on the right ] track I can see, so good luck. ] ] ] ] Thanks a bunch ] ] ] ] Skip ] ] Rich Borders ]

2 1

I'm a new piano tuner to the area
by Doug Freeze 08 Jun '04

08 Jun '04

Hi, I hope you don't mind me writing you. I came across your e-mail address after looking around some websites local to my city and thought I'd ask if you're in need of a professional piano tuner or might know of someone you could forward this e-mail to. I moved into the area a few months ago and I'm tuning for donations until I build-up a customer base so payment is whatever you'd like it to be. I'll travel to the Los Angeles, San Bernardino, Riverside, Ventura and the Orange County areas. Here's a map of where I live in case you'd like to know: http://home.wirelis.com (If this message went out of the area, I apologize. It's not meant to be spam and you'll never receive another message from me again.) You can visit my website or call me if you have any questions. Thanks and I'm sorry if I bothered you or if you don't need this service, Doug Freeze A new resident of Glendora CA. (626) 290-0908 http://dougfreeze.com/piano/index.html http://wirelis.com P.S. You'll never receive another message from me so there's no need to write me back and ask to be removed from my mailing list nor will your e-mail address ever be given away or sold to anyone. See http://dougfreeze.com/wirelis/spam.html to view my position on SPAM and learn how you can help stop it. http://spam.abuse.net

1 0

Tape positioning connected to the F720 filer.
by Harbhajan Julka 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

Hello everyone, I have been programming a client using the NetApp F720 server. The GetStateReply from the server returns the position of the media (usually tape) connected to the server. Two of the position structure members: Filemark and Blockno are something that i need to know about. The filemark and blockno respectively indicate the Partition and the BlockLow of the Position on the tape. I need to know if this is right or not. Also, how can i know what is the value of BlockHigh and offset from the server in the GetStateReply? I have tried a backup and then a restore from the tape. A complete restore is successful but fails to restore few files selected from the media. Please help. Any pointers and suggestions appreciated. Cheers, Sonia. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger

1 0

RE: Defraging the excahgne DB
by SKIP HOFMANN 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

In that case how do you defrag your exchange DB copy the DB to another server with double or triple the amount of the exchange DB size and then run esentuil? Skip _____ From: Waters, George S Mr. [mailto:george.scott.waters@us.army.mil] Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 10:28 AM To: avarni(a)tech.cj.com Cc: SKIP HOFMANN; 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB I've had it "pause" indefinitely even when I am not over my SnapShot Reserve. NetApp support told me it was a "known issue". I have never been able to get a "WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE" to work on my Exchange Volumes. - Scott W. _____ From: avarni(a)tech.cj.com Sent: Mon 6/7/2004 1:18 PM To: Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM Cc: 'SKIP HOFMANN'; 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB At least on 6.3.2 -- I've noticed that WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE will 'pause' indefinately IFF you're over your snapshot reserve. Otherwise I've run this many times with no problems. Make sure you aren't over your snapshot reserve and your scan should 'continue'. On Mon, 7 Jun 2004, Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM wrote: ] ] WOW ... this is the exact opposite of what NetApp support told me. ] ] On a volume used for storing Exchange data, the WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE command ] will never complete. It goes for a while and then stalls. ] ] We monitor the layout ratios weekly and schedule down time to perform an ] offline DEFRAG every 4 - 6 weeks. ] ] This is all based on information received at the time ... If NetApp has ] fixed this then someone enlighten me. ] ] ] - Scott W. ] ] ] -----Original Message----- ] From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com] ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 2:31 PM ] To: 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com ] Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB ] ] ] Hi ] ] I just got done talking with support at Netapp, and they told me that doing ] an offline defrag of my exchange DB using the esutil will have absolutely no ] impact on the exchange DB on the filer, and they also told me that in order ] to defrag the exchange DB I must use the fillers Waffle utility to do this ] and that this would also defragment everything on the vol. They said that ] it's the responsibility of the file system on the filer to determine if a ] vol is fragmented or not, this includes all data on the vol. So knowing this ] is it safe to defrag a vol that contains an exchange DB?? ] ] Thanks again for your help it is much appreciated ] ] Skip ] ] -----Original Message----- ] From: Borders, Rich [mailto:Rich.Borders@netapp.com] ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 11:13 AM ] To: SKIP HOFMANN; toasters(a)mathworks.com ] Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB ] ] <<>> ] ] ] From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com] ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 1:33 PM ] To: toasters(a)mathworks.com ] Subject: Defraging the excahgne DB ] ] ] ] Howdy ] ] ] ] I have my exchange 5.5 DB pub and priv and my filler it's a ] FAS250 and I want to know a few things ] ] ] ] #1 can I run the eseutil utility if the DB is on my FAS 250 to ] defrag the DB? ] ] ] ] ] ] <<< This is doable as it is an offline defrag. The curious thing about ] doing this is that you are accomplishing the APPLICATION defrag, and at ] the same time getting a great by-product of a WAFL defrag. ( Essentially ] a database re-write ) >>> ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ] #2 is it the filer that determines if the exchange DB is ] fragmented or not, and if it is how would I defrag the DB? ] ] ] ] <<<The Application can fragment ( very common and accounted for by an ] online and offline defrag funciton in Exchange ) and the Filer can ] fragment. I say that tounge in cheek because the fragmentation is really ] only identified when you access the data. Since the database is one ] large file the request for data in it is atypical, the data 'fragments' ] over time. The blocks of the filer rarely match up to the blocks of the ] database, so the issues becomes when you want to get a LOT of sequential ] data from a large file ( aka mail store verify ) you will be essentially ] asking the filer to scan through it's blocks at a super high rate of ] speed.>>> ] ] ] ] ] ] #3 what happens to all other data that is stored on the same vol ] as the exchange DB once I defrag this vol? ie snap shots ] ] ] <<<The Mail store can be reallocated or the volume can. I would ] recommend the snapshots be removed as you can really get yourself into a ] pickle by 'RE'-writing a database with an application defrag, or a WAFL ] reallocate. If you are short on space, you need to get the snapshots out ] of there. Snapshots are locked images and if the file system is ] 'fragmented' then it is unlikely that you are doing much more than ] spinning your wheels if you are trying to defragment into a fragemnted ] snapshot. >>> ] ] ] ] #4 I ran a waffle scan and I got a reading of 1.8 si this ] fragmented? ] ] ] That is basically a ratio of actual file size ( df essentially ) to ] block allocation. Ex. A one terabyte volume has a 500 gig database. If ] it's layout is 1 then the File is essentially using the exact number of ] blocks that a Filer of 500 gigs needs. If the layout were 1.8 then the ] 500 gig df would still be 500 but the block allocation would actually be ] closer to the 900 gig . This is usually not an issue until the ratio ] takes the block allocation higher then the volume size. A 2.1 layout ] would mean that a 500 gig df would be 1.05 TB. This means you are ] rescanning on a request of data on the last .05 TB. If the Filer were a ] 900 gig df, then a layout of 1.8 would be MUCH more impactful. It is not ] the end of the world, you just have to manage it. You are on the right ] track I can see, so good luck. ] ] ] ] Thanks a bunch ] ] ] ] Skip ] ] Rich Borders ]

1 0

RE: Defraging the excahgne DB
by Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

WOW ... this is the exact opposite of what NetApp support told me. On a volume used for storing Exchange data, the WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE command will never complete. It goes for a while and then stalls. We monitor the layout ratios weekly and schedule down time to perform an offline DEFRAG every 4 - 6 weeks. This is all based on information received at the time ... If NetApp has fixed this then someone enlighten me. - Scott W. -----Original Message----- From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 2:31 PM To: 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB Hi I just got done talking with support at Netapp, and they told me that doing an offline defrag of my exchange DB using the esutil will have absolutely no impact on the exchange DB on the filer, and they also told me that in order to defrag the exchange DB I must use the fillers Waffle utility to do this and that this would also defragment everything on the vol. They said that it's the responsibility of the file system on the filer to determine if a vol is fragmented or not, this includes all data on the vol. So knowing this is it safe to defrag a vol that contains an exchange DB?? Thanks again for your help it is much appreciated Skip -----Original Message----- From: Borders, Rich [mailto:Rich.Borders@netapp.com] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 11:13 AM To: SKIP HOFMANN; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB <<>> From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 1:33 PM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Defraging the excahgne DB Howdy I have my exchange 5.5 DB pub and priv and my filler it's a FAS250 and I want to know a few things #1 can I run the eseutil utility if the DB is on my FAS 250 to defrag the DB? <<< This is doable as it is an offline defrag. The curious thing about doing this is that you are accomplishing the APPLICATION defrag, and at the same time getting a great by-product of a WAFL defrag. ( Essentially a database re-write ) >>> #2 is it the filer that determines if the exchange DB is fragmented or not, and if it is how would I defrag the DB? <<<The Application can fragment ( very common and accounted for by an online and offline defrag funciton in Exchange ) and the Filer can fragment. I say that tounge in cheek because the fragmentation is really only identified when you access the data. Since the database is one large file the request for data in it is atypical, the data 'fragments' over time. The blocks of the filer rarely match up to the blocks of the database, so the issues becomes when you want to get a LOT of sequential data from a large file ( aka mail store verify ) you will be essentially asking the filer to scan through it's blocks at a super high rate of speed.>>> #3 what happens to all other data that is stored on the same vol as the exchange DB once I defrag this vol? ie snap shots <<<The Mail store can be reallocated or the volume can. I would recommend the snapshots be removed as you can really get yourself into a pickle by 'RE'-writing a database with an application defrag, or a WAFL reallocate. If you are short on space, you need to get the snapshots out of there. Snapshots are locked images and if the file system is 'fragmented' then it is unlikely that you are doing much more than spinning your wheels if you are trying to defragment into a fragemnted snapshot. >>> #4 I ran a waffle scan and I got a reading of 1.8 si this fragmented? That is basically a ratio of actual file size ( df essentially ) to block allocation. Ex. A one terabyte volume has a 500 gig database. If it's layout is 1 then the File is essentially using the exact number of blocks that a Filer of 500 gigs needs. If the layout were 1.8 then the 500 gig df would still be 500 but the block allocation would actually be closer to the 900 gig . This is usually not an issue until the ratio takes the block allocation higher then the volume size. A 2.1 layout would mean that a 500 gig df would be 1.05 TB. This means you are rescanning on a request of data on the last .05 TB. If the Filer were a 900 gig df, then a layout of 1.8 would be MUCH more impactful. It is not the end of the world, you just have to manage it. You are on the right track I can see, so good luck. Thanks a bunch Skip Rich Borders

3 2

RE: Defraging the excahgne DB
by SKIP HOFMANN 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

It seems that Netapp is very confused about this issue and or topic, as I have called into tech support on three separate occasions about this issue and I'm always left feeling more confused than when I called in. Netapp needs to figure this out and give an answer to this question, which I think should be a YES or NO answer. Can the waffle scan safely defrag an exchange DB, if so what are the steps? If a waffle scan cannot defrag an exchange DB then can running eseutil and pointing eseutil to the exchange DB on the filler run, and will it defrag the DB? Thanks Skip _____ From: Waters, G Scott THE LOG.SEC TEAM [mailto:george.scott.waters@us.army.mil] Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 7:33 AM To: SKIP HOFMANN; 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB Importance: High WOW ... this is the exact opposite of what NetApp support told me. On a volume used for storing Exchange data, the WAFL SCAN REALLOCATE command will never complete. It goes for a while and then stalls. We monitor the layout ratios weekly and schedule down time to perform an offline DEFRAG every 4 - 6 weeks. This is all based on information received at the time ... If NetApp has fixed this then someone enlighten me. - Scott W. -----Original Message----- From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com <mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com> ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 2:31 PM To: 'Borders, Rich'; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB Hi I just got done talking with support at Netapp, and they told me that doing an offline defrag of my exchange DB using the esutil will have absolutely no impact on the exchange DB on the filer, and they also told me that in order to defrag the exchange DB I must use the fillers Waffle utility to do this and that this would also defragment everything on the vol. They said that it's the responsibility of the file system on the filer to determine if a vol is fragmented or not, this includes all data on the vol. So knowing this is it safe to defrag a vol that contains an exchange DB?? Thanks again for your help it is much appreciated Skip -----Original Message----- From: Borders, Rich [mailto:Rich.Borders@netapp.com <mailto:Rich.Borders@netapp.com> ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 11:13 AM To: SKIP HOFMANN; toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: RE: Defraging the excahgne DB <<>> From: SKIP HOFMANN [mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com <mailto:SKIP.HOFMANN@ttisg.com> ] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 1:33 PM To: toasters(a)mathworks.com Subject: Defraging the excahgne DB Howdy I have my exchange 5.5 DB pub and priv and my filler it's a FAS250 and I want to know a few things #1 can I run the eseutil utility if the DB is on my FAS 250 to defrag the DB? <<< This is doable as it is an offline defrag. The curious thing about doing this is that you are accomplishing the APPLICATION defrag, and at the same time getting a great by-product of a WAFL defrag. ( Essentially a database re-write ) >>> #2 is it the filer that determines if the exchange DB is fragmented or not, and if it is how would I defrag the DB? <<<The Application can fragment ( very common and accounted for by an online and offline defrag funciton in Exchange ) and the Filer can fragment. I say that tounge in cheek because the fragmentation is really only identified when you access the data. Since the database is one large file the request for data in it is atypical, the data 'fragments' over time. The blocks of the filer rarely match up to the blocks of the database, so the issues becomes when you want to get a LOT of sequential data from a large file ( aka mail store verify ) you will be essentially asking the filer to scan through it's blocks at a super high rate of speed.>>> #3 what happens to all other data that is stored on the same vol as the exchange DB once I defrag this vol? ie snap shots <<<The Mail store can be reallocated or the volume can. I would recommend the snapshots be removed as you can really get yourself into a pickle by 'RE'-writing a database with an application defrag, or a WAFL reallocate. If you are short on space, you need to get the snapshots out of there. Snapshots are locked images and if the file system is 'fragmented' then it is unlikely that you are doing much more than spinning your wheels if you are trying to defragment into a fragemnted snapshot. >>> #4 I ran a waffle scan and I got a reading of 1.8 si this fragmented? That is basically a ratio of actual file size ( df essentially ) to block allocation. Ex. A one terabyte volume has a 500 gig database. If it's layout is 1 then the File is essentially using the exact number of blocks that a Filer of 500 gigs needs. If the layout were 1.8 then the 500 gig df would still be 500 but the block allocation would actually be closer to the 900 gig . This is usually not an issue until the ratio takes the block allocation higher then the volume size. A 2.1 layout would mean that a 500 gig df would be 1.05 TB. This means you are rescanning on a request of data on the last .05 TB. If the Filer were a 900 gig df, then a layout of 1.8 would be MUCH more impactful. It is not the end of the world, you just have to manage it. You are on the right track I can see, so good luck. Thanks a bunch Skip Rich Borders

1 0

RE: Best practices for new RAID group
by Yarmas, Tom 04 Jun '04

04 Jun '04

The paper you reference is a little dated unless you are still running 5.x of Data ONTAP. Data ONTAP version 6.x included some significant changes to the WAFL and ONTAP RAID. The number of RAID groups is much less relevant than the total number of data drives in the volume. However, adding 1 or two drives to a volume (or RAID Group) is still not the best approach. Your best bet is to add a new RAID group of 6 disks to the volume. You will be adding the disks anyway (over time), and you are using qtrees to divvy up the space, so just add them all at one time and not worry about it. As Chris Thompson pointed out you can use RAID-DP (assuming you are running DOT 6.5), and add 2 disks to the existing RAID group. But that would likely not be optimal because you would still have a small number of "empty" disks in the RAID group and they will be utilized more than the other "more full" disks until space gets more evenly distributed across all of the drives. -tom -----Original Message----- From: Stewart, John [mailto:johns@artesyncp.com] Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 5:44 PM To: 'toasters(a)mathworks.com' Cc: IT Technical Services Subject: Best practices for new RAID group We've got an F740 with three shelves of 36GB disks (the 3rd recently added). We've only got one volume, vol0, with 14 disks in it now (13 data and one parity). We use both CIFS and NFS. We have 7 spare disks (6 of which we'd like to eventually use for data, with one spare of course). I just went to add one of the spare disks to vol0 (running low on space) and got the error: vol add: starting a new RAID group; at least two disks are needed So, as I (now) understand it, we've got to either: - Override the 14 disk limit for a RAID group or - Add a new RAID group to the current volume or - Add a new volume The 3rd choice is unattractive because we like the idea of One Huge Filesystem, that we can divvy up as needed into different qtrees. The 2nd choice sounds like a Bad Idea in that according to this document, section 3.4: http://www.netapp.com/tech_library/3027.html, that the filer will try to distribute writes evenly between the old and new RAID group... if the new RAID group only contains two disks (we don't want to add more disk space than is needed now), this could be disatrous to performance So is the 1st choice, increasing the size of the RAID group, a viable option? What is the downsize? Only increased risk of a double disk failure taking out the whole system? Is it possible to add a second parity disk to the same RAID group? Am I missing something here? Any clue-by-fours quite welcome. thanks johnS

1 0

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